[GrannieAnnie]

some people do mix their won feeds up, like Muntjac used to.  Don't know if he still does, but it isn't just chucking them a lot of grain in their runs.

I'll try to find the post he put on ages ago, unless someone with more time finds it first!!   

People reminisce (sp??) about the old days where they just chucked out scraps to the chickens in the yard, but as they reproduced quite easily, how long did the hens really live?  We are led to believe they lived to a ripe old age just scratching about, but did they??

[dizzylizzie]

hi , ive read muntjac's post about him mixing his own, if i knew a quarter of what he knew about chucks i might feel safe doing it.  , but sadly , i dont
i totally agree with you about what people say about the good old days, but thankfully things have moved on. im sure if people had the knowlage and the things available to them that we are lucky enough to have today, most people would have used them. Progress is a good thing, and i for one am glad that manufactors are now making sure my chickens are as well fed as they can be.
chickens may have eaten table scraps etc, but peoples diets were different then , lots of veg etc, no convience foods, GM products etc....
well , like i say, im just glad that i have that reasurance by giving them pellets

[digga666]

Hmmm  i am listening but still not totally convinced for a couple of reasons.....

1.   Is everything in layers pellets a natural chicken food source?  even with organic feed the feeds are designed so you can produce eggs i would have thought and the main point would be to make money for the egg producer or the feed manufacturer?

2.   Now we find that feeding birds for the table just grain as long as they are outside free ranging is perfectly ok, so what's different about Hens that they must have manufactured pellets?   is it because they live a lot longer?

[the ancient one]

I've also been in a quandary about pol pullets and the correct pellets. When I picked them up I was told they were on growers but could go onto layers if I wanted. However, someone who keeps about 300 chickens told me that feeding layers pellets/mash too early could lead to liver damage as the extra calcium for egg production is not used properly, and to keep them on growers until they are well established layers.

I tried to find unmedicated growers, as apparently you can't use any eggs produced if they are on medicated growers(?), but drew a blank, at least locally.

It seems many people feed layers pellets/mash with little problem to birds not in lay, so taking the middle route I now mix growers and layers about 50-50, probably ridiculous but it keeps me happy, and the hens seem to love it when its presented soaked.

This gentleman also advised that grain feeding is only viable if they are fully free range and get all the other requirements in the field.

But I've only just started in the poultry keeping journey, so I'm sure there are many out there better qualified to advise.

[digga666]

This is it, all i want to do is produce an egg containing natural ingredients by feeding my birds natural ingredients and keeping them naturally in their natural enviroment.

Is organic pelleted feed natural chicken food or has it got organic ingredients added, so can i go down the "just grain" route?

Has anybody tried this way or knows of someone who has?

Or are my birds going to succumb to some kind of defficiency?.......It seems hard to believe that you cant just feed a bird its natural food and leave it just as that if they are free ranging on open grass.

 

[dizzylizzie]

hi Digga, this website seems to offer advice on mixing your own food, and feeding organicly
http://www.greenerpasturesfarm.com/ChickenFeedRecipe.html
hope its of som use

[digga666]

Thanks DL quite interesting, so i am not the only one then

[hillfooter]

I always have to smile when people start to talk about what constitutes "natural feed" and what chickens would eat "in the wild".  Poultrygeist is quite right when he talks about chickens being "manufactured " with these feeds in mind as there's no such thing as a "wild chicken".  They are a domesticated animal created by man from Red Jungle Fowl ancestors in relative recent times (speaking on the scale of evolution) of about 8 thousand years.  Egg layers are an even more modern development being selectively bred only a few hundreds of years ago.  They don't have a natural diet in the sense that they have evolved through some Darwinian selection process.  They differ considerably in their needs from the undomesticated Jungle fowl in that unlike chickens Jungle Fowl only lay fertile eggs like other wild birds.  The diet which man has created for laying chx is designed to support their egg producing lifestyles and to give optimum economy of production and quality of eggs, not necessarily to give the chx a long life.  You might argue that that to prolong life time you should not optimise their feeding for maximum egg production but actually try and repress their production a little.  I have heard it said that chx are capable of living to 30 years or so but in fact most succumb before they reach 6 due to illness.  Feed is not the only consideration for long life but husbandry plays a very major role also.
But what to feed then?  It all depends on what you want for your birds.  Do you want long life or do you want lots of eggs?   I suspect most of us want somewhere in between, a healthy productive life which is not prolonged into decrepit old age and ill health.  Unfortunately all the really scientifically credible work is done on feeding and lifestyles for short term commercial high production.  This is how we arrive at layers feeds and intensive farming husbandry.  This isn’t to say that everything in Layers feed is bad.  Far from it, and in fact they contain well balanced formulated nutrients which are designed to maintain health and quality egg production for the typical hen.  You will only get good quality plentiful eggs if your hen is in good health.  However if in a free range back garden situation you were not to attempt peak production all the time and were to supplement layers with treats such as corn and household scraps you probably would reduce the stress of production and your chickens might live longer and have better health into old age.  So layers as the staple diet with 5% treats is what many experts recommend.  There’s no precise formula that I know of, nutritionists still haven’t ‘worked it out for humans yet, and you in all likelihood won’t go far wrong egg-wise and health-wise if you stick to this formula.
Whether you believe this is “natural” or that “organic” equals healthy is a matter of religion.  We and everything we eat drink touch or breathe is quite literally just star dust.
Regards

[Hawthorn Harry]

Wow!!  That was some post!!!

Firstly,  I could not have put it any better - a very eloquent, accurate and informative post.

Secondly, following the same principles how many people, feed their dogs a 'complete' food as opposed to the odd dead carcass every 2 or 3 days?  I know a few do, but once we made the wolf into a dog we had to adapt their feed accordingly.  The same principles apply to fowl.  

The answer is simple, give them the best that you can and look after their basic needs, the rest is purely cosmetic!!

Enjoy your chooks for what they are.
 

[joyfull]

Hi Lizzie, just catching up on all the posts I missed whilst away for a week and quickly read yours. I had my young hens running around with my older girls and all were fed on a mixture of growers and layers together, but mine are on organic feed which means no anti cocci medication is added so eating any eggs from my layers was not a problem. Now my girls are over 16 weeks old they can all eat just layers.

[karlooben]

i have just looked at that link for making your own feed an its seems a very expensive way of doing it  but now i am paranoid are you safe to eat eggs from birds that are on medicated feed as mine on fed on that an the eggs are fine ?? i use the farmers range i think its the greeny blue bags .

[poultrygeist]

Do you mean Farmgate Looby ?

Is it the growers you're using still ?

Rob

[karlooben]

hi rob , yeh thats the fed i am on an no the growers was stopped a while back as all the birds were in together { found it impossible to keep the babies seprate no matter how well i thought i had built the fence . thing is it cant be that bad as one of the white sussex is laying double yolkers on a regular basis 

[poultrygeist]

I think it's only the growers that is medicated. You can always check with them.

If you're still alive and haven't grown any feathers, then all should be well. Now settle down on your perch and have a preen before you get your corn 

Rob 

[karlooben]

  u are so sillyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy  and i could reply something else to this but i shall not not not not i'll have to go to the naughty step