[Goosegirl]

I'm not aware that tomatoes have been geneticall-modified but a friend of my OH was going to buy some seeds and was horrified that they had been GM-ed. Is she getting mixed up with the "F1 " terminology?

[DD.]

I suspect she is. You can't buy them over here, but have a look at this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-25885756

[NewSteve]

No, she's not confused. They have genetically modified purple tomatoes. Something to do with more antioxidants in the purple flesh (which doesn't explain WHY they felt the need to produce GM tomatoes).

[JayG]

Probably - GM seeds aren't sold in the UK, although she may have bought them from abroad. 

Interesting read DD! 

[mumofstig]

You can buy seed of purple and blue tomatoes from non gm breeding programmes - so why they needed to GM them is beyond me   

[Nobbie]

You can buy seed of purple and blue tomatoes from non gm breeding programmes - so why they needed to GM them is beyond me   

It's generally because they have a plant with all the good characteristic they want such as shelf life, desease resistance and vigour, but it's red. It's probably easier to add the gene for 'purpleness' or 'antioxidant' than to try and breed the other characteristics into the purple toms.

[Headgardener22]

Are these the same people as did the GM to Desiree potatoes to introduce Blight resistance?

Their argument was that it was exactly the same as selective breeding but quicker. I suppose I can't disagree with them providing they are only introducing genes from tahe same fruit or vegetable and the seeds are viable. My problem is when they introduce something that couldn't happen in nature or where the resulting plant is sterile so can only be reproduced by the GM company at great expense to the growers.

[Yorkie]

 F1 breeding is natural selection of plants exhibiting certain characteristics.

GM is artificial manipulation of plant characteristics.

[Nobbie]

F1 breeding is natural selection of plants exhibiting certain characteristics.

GM is artificial manipulation of plant characteristics.

There's nothing 'natural' about the process forproducing F1 seed, it's a totally artificial process that does not happen in nature, hence the high prices due the amount of intervention required.

[Yorkie]

But it does not involve the genetic manipulation required of GM.  There is a difference.  One is perfectly legal and has no impact on the environment.  The other is unlicensed with unassessed impact on the environment.

[solway cropper]

F1 breeding is natural selection of plants exhibiting certain characteristics.

GM is artificial manipulation of plant characteristics.

There's nothing 'natural' about the process forproducing F1 seed, it's a totally artificial process that does not happen in nature, hence the high prices due the amount of intervention required.

There's nothing natural about every single one of the varieties we grow for the table. All are the result of selective breeding, often over centuries. We could, of course, go back to foraging for dandelion roots and crab apples but personally I think I'm happier in the twenty-first century than I might have been in the twelfth!

[JayG]

The word 'natural' is abused nearly as much as the word 'organic', and means very little without a precise definition.

What I am sure about is that because selective seed breeding takes many years it makes it a lot easier to detect and manage any adverse consequences of doing so.

Inserting genes from often completely unrelated organisms is a huge step change by comparison, and I believe people are right to be concerned about adverse effects which can't realistically be predicted by limited trials.

[mumofstig]

Everytime a plant gets pollinated by another it is an f1 (first cross) variety - whether aided by humans or not - it's perfectly natural
The skill in the breeders work is to ensure, if the resulting plant is worth the effort of reproducing it, the same result again and again - by hand pollination each time. The seed is still only the result of pollination, so natural, but which plant has bred with which has been selected by humans.


So, IMO genetic modification is completely different - creating varieties in a laboratory, which could never be produced naturally.

[Goosegirl]

Probably - GM seeds aren't sold in the UK, although she may have bought them from abroad. 

Interesting read DD! 

Apparently, they were bought in France. MOS has put the issue about F1 and GM very succinctly.

[Nobbie]

Everytime a plant gets pollinated by another it is an f1 (first cross) variety - whether aided by humans or not - it's perfectly natural
The skill in the breeders work is to ensure, if the resulting plant is worth the effort of reproducing it, the same result again and again - by hand pollination each time. The seed is still only the result of pollination, so natural, but which plant has bred with which has been selected by humans.


So, IMO genetic modification is completely different - creating varieties in a laboratory, which could never be produced naturally.

But in the specific case we're discussing, there are already non GM purple tomatoes, so the purple tomatoes gene exists and it would be posssible to create a non GM equivalent by a long programme of  selective breeding.