[foxknocker]

Hi I'm new here, we had inspections at our allotments this summer and I failed! The weeds really seemed to run wild this year and despite it being my third year (first year cleared wasteland second year battled wasteland third year got swallowed up in wasteland) it got really shabby. We've done lots of work since failing and THINK we must have passed second one as there hasn't been a letter... still need some advice about controlling weeds and grass. The whole allotment was grassed over when we took it on and we cleared this off, and have raised beds in some areas, a bit of wasteland remains but we want to dig that out later this autumn to let the frost at it. Not even sure thats the best idea, grow green manure perhaps? Gutted we failed so have joined to get advice from friendly plot holders ....*whispers* because there aren't many where we are.........  .. I best not say where we are now!!




 

[Aunt Sally]

Hi there foxknocker

How big is your plot ? and how much help do you have with it ?

We can give you lots of advice but we need to know the size of the problem first.

[foxknocker]

Thank you Aunt Sally its 90 X 30 feet I think, a full sized one.  10 rods? They might vary all over the country but ours are all this large size. We don't really want a half one, as we've put in paving and built the raised beds and stuff like that. Any help is great though hello.


oh, Theres me and my husband and two under tens... occasionally my dad helps out too.

[Aunt Sally]

10 rods is quite a large plot to get under control and it all depends on how much time you are willing to put in and what methods you want to use.

Glyphosate will knock  the weeds down and get you through inspections if it can bee seen that you are steadily working your way through the plot improving the soil and growing crops.  If you don't want to use a herbicide then you will have to keep the weeds down by strimming and covering with black weed control fabric until you can dig the perennial weed roots out - it's a more expensive option than glyphosate and a hoe and much more time consuming. 

As someone who inspects plots, I would have expected you to have had it under control by now.  We usually give just encouragement and advice the first year and then expect a nearly well managed plot by the second year and definitely by the third year.

If your main problem is weeds then you really need to visit more frequently. If you run the hoe over your plot once a week at the height of the weed season you will have very little problem and the job will be easy.

We have 10 rods (but no small children now - we did have when we started allotment growing).  I would say that we average about 5-7 hours per week each (2 of us) during the growing season and about 2-3 each during the cooler months.

If you don't have enough time to keep the weeds under control than you'll have to do a lot of mulching and use weed suppressant fabric.  Don't let weeds produce seeds as this will annoy neighbours and make your job much harder to control fresh growth in subsequent years.

There will be lots more people around to give you advice so you can pick and choose which you take

[foxknocker]

   Its mainly weeds and grass, I'm going to be spending much more time there as it was really embarrassing to fail I might try the Glyphosate hadn't wanted to, but its grassing over again behind my back while I clear my already dug beds of weeds.
If it will kill the grass I will give it a try, and go on pulling the other weeds out and covering up or planting. Its mainly me who has time to go but we all go some weekends. I will try mulches too, I use the black fabric round my fruit bushes and my tree. Thank for the help.

[Nikkithefoot]

The only problem with glyphosate at this time of year is weeds are growing a little more slowly with the cooler weather, and they really need to be actively growing for best results, also you need at least 6 hours free from rain/ damp etc AFTER applying the glyphosate to be effective.

Good luck

[Aunt Sally]

That's true.  It does depend where you are in the country too.  I'm in Kent and my weeds are still growing well.

I would knock them down now and again in spring.  But if you're up north - I think I'd still have a go now but with one that kills off top growth too e.g. Resolva

[Salmo]

September is an excellent time to apply Glyphosate as there is usually a growth spurt as the days cool a little. Maybe water it to encourage growth.

If you have plenty of green shoots do not mow, strim or cultivate. If you have a matted mess the same applies as long as there are green leaves to spray.

Choose a still day when it is not forecast to rain for 6 hours. The drying time on the leaves is important.

Use a dribble bar attached to a watering can to avoid drift on to places where it is not wanted e.g crops or neighbours plots. Dribble bars are cheap from any garden centre and better than just a normal rose. If you use a sprayer adjust the nozzle to give a coarse spray to avoid drift. Do not apply too much as that is expensive. Do not apply until there is run-off, just a few drops on each leaf is sufficient, . It helps to mark out the plot into convenient strips with string or canes so that you do not miss any or double dose. Double dosing will not matter but it costs more.

After about 10 days you should start to see the middle shoots turn yellow and then the rest of the plant will soon follow. The weeds are now dead and will not revive.

If you see apparent re-growth it will be from plants that either had grown no leaves at the time of applying the weedkiller or were missed. These will need more glyphosate.

You can now dig it over. Technically there is no need to dig out all the roots as these will be dead. In practice dig out as many as you can but it need not be 100%. You can remove the grass layer and compost it, if that will make life easier.

Advice is never to rotovate couch as it chops up the roots and every part re-grows. However, as long as you have done a good job with the weedkiller,  a rotovator can be used as all the roots will be dead.

Do not be in a hurry to plant in the Spring. Wait until things warm up a bit. If grass shoots appear either dig them out to apply more glyphosate. Glyphosate breaks down as soon as it comes into contact with soil so you can plant crops with no delay afterwards.

[sunshineband]

and can I just add that once you have got some ground cleared, cover it up to avoid any weed seeds growing and just recreating the issue.

Membrane or cardboard is good, weighed down with old bricks.

Any weed seeds underneath might germinate but won't last. Uncover it a section at a time when you are going to plant.

The other tip would be to organise the plot into beds that are of a size you can manage easily. These don't have to be raised beds, just growing areas with paths between. Then cover the paths with something to stop weeds growing (back to cardboard, membrane etc, maybe with chipped bark on top -- our council supplies this from time to time if we ask)

and don't give up. As Salmo says, this is an ideal time to do thsi work

PS Can you add where you are to your locality in your profile? It shouldn;t give away where your site is, and will help with replying to your posts.

[Christine]

Foxknocker, lots of us fail inspections and still live to see another year on our plot. Now that you know what the inspection looks for you know what is expected of you.

There's an old trick that does the rounds up here at this time of year. Dig over patch by patch, top off with cardboard as soon as cleared and then pop a layer of manure, compost on top. Start of next season all you have to do is a light turn to work in this top layer and hey presto your beds are all ready to go.

It will take some time to clear nicely as you go but next year you then have a fighting chance of keeping on top of things. Does the idea help?

[Growster...]

Spraying is of course, a final -expensive - way to get rid of the stuff, but I've recently tended to just raze the top inch or so, by using a cross-mattock.

This is like a pick axe, with a 4" wide blade, and if used steadily, will have enough clout to knock off the main weeds, and you can then dig with a fork to finish the job.

I reckon it takes an hour to do about four sq.yds. that way. But it will have been given a right good seeing to!

I'm not happy about trying to compost the scrapings, (too many thistle roots and lumps of couch grass) so they go on the communal tip.

I sometimes wish they bothered to inspect our plots, there are far too many just left unattended. We have actually lost about five whole plots which have alder trees thirty ft high growing on them!

[Aunt Sally]

I sometimes wish they bothered to inspect our plots, there are far too many just left unattended. We have actually lost about five whole plots which have alder trees thirty ft high growing on them!

That's disgraceful Growster !

[noshed]

This time of year a lot of the weeds will be annual ones which you can rip out by hand fairly easily. I know this because my plot is waist high in them. Rip those out in blocks, making a hot compost heap as you go (mix in some comfrey or accelerant) and it will soon look better. Then mulch, we get black compost off the council, which is quite good but cardboard and manure or green manure is good.
But AS is right, regular hoeing at the crucial time is the key (which I slacked off from this year and am paying the price) But I reckon one weekend will sort it out.
I mainly use the glyphosate on the bindweed climbing up the fence.

[Growster...]

I sometimes wish they bothered to inspect our plots, there are far too many just left unattended. We have actually lost about five whole plots which have alder trees thirty ft high growing on them!

That's disgraceful Growster !

It is really Auntie. Admittedly, it has happened over about 25 years, but I can remember seeing thriving plots down at the bottom, which are now totally obliterated.

I want to see as many being used as possible - something about protecting our interests...

I don't even care that we don't have water laid on, there are some generous souls who have been letting us have those big containers (forgotten their proper name), and we can then save run-off water from sheds,etc.

[foxknocker]

Thank you Nikkithefoot, Salmo, Aunt Sally, Sunshineband, Christine, Growster and Noshed all great advice. I'm drawing up a plan of action and will let you know how it goes. I've added my location in my profile now, its a good suggestion as we have different times for seasons, I hadn't thought of that.  I will be weed killing this weekend weather and family commitments allowing.