[Spudman]

I'm no dig too.....I dug the allotment over when I first took it on, but from now will be putting wood round the edges of the beds (all 15' by 5'), never digging them, just adding compost/mulch on top and letting the worms take it down. The theory is that there is a natural eco system below the top of the soil with worms and other insects doing their jobs, and this is disturbed by digging, along with germinating weed seeds that are down below. I'll even be trying potatoes on top of manure/compost and covered with weed suppressant material......no idea how this will work out though.

A couple of relevant sites:

http://www.no-dig-vegetablegarden.com/

http://www.charlesdowding.co.uk/

[braders1234]

Charles Dowding has some good books on the subject including the one metioned above, he also has a decent website.

http://www.charlesdowding.co.uk/

For me no dig is a no brainer.  I do not have the time to dig over the whole plot and then weed everything I have dug.  I just add compost and rotted manure where necesary each year to the raised and non raised beds I have made, I have great water retention and hardly any weeds.  My neighbour rotavated this year and is now knee deep in a carpet of weeds.

Probably a more expensive way of doing it, unless you have access to a lot of free manure and compost, but I have more spare cash than spare time.

[Dirt Diver]

LOVE this web site, it's like going back to school and your in the middle of a teachers debate.

I'm going to try I have a lot of old compost which should help.

BUT I also have two horses can I use their manure straight on the beds to over winter, it has been collected for the past year.

[mumofstig]

Probably a more expensive way of doing it, unless you have access to a lot of free manure and compost, but I have more spare cash than spare time.

That's the problem with a completely no dig system...................I have more time than cash, and no free manure!

I only deep dig when starting the beds, and do not get walked on. After that it's only the top that gets forked over when adding compost or fertiliser (organic for me) or when digging/planting potatoes.

So there is a middle way that doesn't involve a great deal of expense or a lot of digging.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do

[Trillium]

Dirt Diver, yes, you can use the fresh manure on the beds this fall provided it's not on areas where you've planted fall garlic or winter onions. They can't take all the strong ammonia and such. The rest of your manure can be stacked somewhere to rot down, which can then be used whenever needed. I'd recommend starting piles at different times so you're not continually adding to a decomposing pile and having to dig out the good stuff from the bottom.

[Dirt Diver]

Thanks Trillium thats very helpful.
 I have started a compost of all the kitchen peelings etc but guess that won't be useable for some time.

[Zippy]

Probably a more expensive way of doing it, unless you have access to a lot of free manure and compost, but I have more spare cash than spare time.

Each to their own, but if you consider the hours spent digging over a plot and then compare this against finding and driving out to a source of manure (stables, whatever), building a rapport with the farmer or stable owners, filling the car up with black gold and bringing it back to the plot and top dressing your beds, I prefer the no-dig system every time.

I have made friends and connections with people outside the plot and I have still had my exercise digging manure rather than my allotment soil and my soil ecosystem is left intact. I have said before that not so long ago we were almost all agricultural workers of some kind and ploughing the fields was the only way to cultivate enough soil to feed everyone and incorporate animal dung into the soil.

We are not growing on that scale and so the no-dig system makes so much more sense to me.  You only have to dig around in a no-dig bed to see the size of the earthworms in there compared to a plot which is regularly dug.

Controversial I am sure, but I suggest that people dig because they have heard from people who have heard that is what you have to do.

[Spudman]

Some people even do away with collecting and spreading animal manure, and instead use a mixture of compost and green manure, and in a no dig situation cutting down the green manure and leaving on top for the worms.

Vegan Organic network:

http://www.veganorganic.net/information-sheets/4-vegan-organic-growing-the-basics

[Zippy]

I tried to go veganic to see what the effect would be. It was much easier to collect lawn mowings from friends and fallen leaves from local parks in autumn (with permission) and much nicer to handle.

However, my onions didn't really put on any weight and a lot of plants just looked yellow even if watered, so I gather the animal manure was the thing that was lacking or there just wasn't enough vegetable compost and manure to provide the necessary nutrients for an intensive plot - intensive because in nature you don't see the same amount of produce coming from the same area as you do when working an allotment.

I am of the opinion that in nature you don't often have ecosystems where there are no animals wandering around and leaving their dung over the area. To provide the same amount of nutrient input without using animal wastes you have to collect from far and wide and very often, whereas animal manure is more concentrated per mass.

I am lucky to be able to strike a nice ethical balance that works. I collect stable manure from a friend who has two horses and a herd of alpacas and more poo than he can deal with and I know the fields are not sprayed with weedkiller so the manure is safe and the animals are well cared for and not part of the factory meat market.  Then through Freecycle and various friends I have access to a good amount of lawn mowings and hutch offerings. Then theres the local tree leaves and of course coffee grounds from Starbucks!

It is possible but it is labour intensive and you have to like collecting stuff and bringing it in.

[mumofstig]

It is possible but it is labour intensive and you have to like collecting stuff and bringing it in

and have a car for the collections or enough money to pay for delivery 

green manures are great for improving soil structure, but I found that they add little in the way of nutrients.........I wish it were that easy

[Zippy]

... or a stable of farm who are only to glad to have somewhere to dump it and will deliver it free of charge so long as you don't want it bagged. There's always a way to get things free or cheap if you are willing to do a bit of digging around!

[WebSiteEvo]

If you move away from a purely annual vegetable system and grow some perennial vegetables you can reduce the amount work required even further. No need to dig or re-seed every bed each year!, just mulch as needed..

For example: I am growing good king henry this year as a spinach alternative and hopefully it will produce year after year. Its grown well so far.

If you have plenty of nitrogen fixers and mineral accumulates and adopt a cut and drop approach you can further reduce the need to bring in organic matter or none-organic fertilizers. The worms are constantly consuming mulch adding worm-castings to the soil providing allot of the nutrients required. If you combine this with kitchen waste, garden compost and green manure you will not be too far off your nutrient requirements. I have also managed to source a daily supply of free vegetable scraps in quite large quantities  which really help in creating large amounts of compost.

Its too early to know for sure but i think I can maintain a good level of soil fertility with out buying any fertilizers or bulk manure and there is little need for digging.

[Spudman]

Its too early to know for sure but i think I can maintain a good level of soil fertility with out buying any fertilizers or bulk manure and there is little need for digging.

This is exactly what I'm aiming for, as I'm forced to, in a way, as I dont own a car and it would probably get expensive having stuff delivered all the time.

Is it okay to put kitchen scraps directly on the soil without composting it first?

[WebSiteEvo]

This is exactly what I'm aiming for, as I'm forced to, in a way, as I dont own a car and it would probably get expensive having stuff delivered all the time.

Is it okay to put kitchen scraps directly on the soil without composting it first?

I compost scraps because of animal issues.

[Spudman]

This is exactly what I'm aiming for, as I'm forced to, in a way, as I dont own a car and it would probably get expensive having stuff delivered all the time.

Is it okay to put kitchen scraps directly on the soil without composting it first?

I compost scraps because of animal issues.

Good point. I may look at one of those Boresha tubs.
I'm also going to grow a comfrey patch, and grow green manure on my paths, to cut and throw on the beds.