[drmoonshine]

hi all im new to growing and just wondering if i'm not able to get any manure is there something else just as good. like maybe blood fish and bone.

i dont know if this is a good thing but most of my allotment has not been grown on for a year or 2 not veg anyway most of it was/is covered in weeds.... is this going to make my allotment less or more fertille? should i treat the whole plot with something like BFB/manure?

if i where to use BFB after it has been added can i grow anything there or is it like manure and only certan things can be grown after manuring

thanks for reading

[Aunt Sally]

Manure is a soil conditioner and adds lots of organic matter to the soil opening it up and making it able to hold more water and hence plant nutrients.

BF&B is not a soil conditioner but a plant nutrient.  You need organic material in the ground first.

If you can't get manure you can make compost from the weeds, vegetable waste, grass cuttings or grow some green manure.

[drmoonshine]

thank you for your reply aunt sally

not i know there is a difference in the 2 things.

is it possible to get manure at the garden center i think i have seen it before?

[Paul Plots]

Compost is the answer for sure 

Grab some grass mowings, add the household green-waste (peelings and the rest), bung in a little (not too much) shredded paper...... anything organic and uncooked... including the softer weeds.

Soon you'll have the makings of a great compost heap. It's a useful place to put all the leaves and unwanted green stuff the allotment will produce.

Patience may well be the problem though... it takes a while to get rotting 

[Paul Plots]

thank you for your reply aunt sally

not i know there is a difference in the 2 things.

is it possible to get manure at the garden center i think i have seen it before?

You can but it is costly - and you'd need 1/2 a ton loads to cover a plot. Compost is free once you've got your compost heap going.

Manure would be ideal for special plants that need an extra kick to get them going in the spring... Compost will improve the soil where ever it is dug in or used on top as a mulch. It's giving nature a helping hand and adding to the fibrous materials in the soil so improving (as Aunty says) the soils ability to hold nutrients.


Pelletted chicken manure can be bought in tubs (around £6 or £7 for about 5 to 6 Kg). It’s clean to handle and use (although it pongs a bit) and can be raked into the soil before planting in the spring. Not all plants like a does of manure…. Depends upon the crop. 

[drmoonshine]

thank you

i would say at the moment the soil is very fibrous due to roots from grass and weeds and things or am i getting the wrong end of the stick? if it has to be manure then manure it has to be ill ask around and see what i can find. you say 1 or 2 ton of the stuff? that sounds like a vast amount of poo to have to dig into my soil lol. fair point its a fair size lotti but i dont know never seen 2 ton of manure so not sure what a pile i'd be looking at

thank you once again

[Paul Plots]

thank you

i would say at the moment the soil is very fibrous due to roots from grass and weeds and things or am i getting the wrong end of the stick? if it has to be manure then manure it has to be ill ask around and see what i can find. you say 1 or 2 ton of the stuff? that sounds like a vast amount of poo to have to dig into my soil lol. fair point its a fair size lotti but i dont know never seen 2 ton of manure so not sure what a pile i'd be looking at

thank you once again

Whoops....... I meant half (1/2) a ton but that'd take some moving so probably a half lorry load from the local farm would be a huge addition.

The weed roots may well have broken up the soil but it is rotted, fibrous vegetable materials that give the worms something to work on and help increase the soils ability to hold moisture and nutrients.

Have a word with other plots holders near to you - ask them what they put on their ground as a great deal depends upon what soil type you have. Having said this compost is useful no matter what. 

In the last 5 years I have relied upon copious amounts of compost and not one ounce of manure (unless the local pigeons have added it while my back is turned!!  )

[Zippy]

I think you'll find that's 1/2 (half) a ton; depends on size of plot.  For a growing space (not including paths) of 50 square yards I'll be using about 100 stone of horse manure; a good elping of this will be along the raspberries, blackcurrant and rhubabarb and I'll drop some on the Comfrey bad to pay them a feed for the goodness they will provide next year.

In addition to this I'll be using my homemade compost as well, especially on beds that don't need a lot of nitrogen.  Also 'll be sowing winter tares as a green manure on some beds as another way of fixing nitrogen and conditioning the soil.

So you see there are lots of ways to improve soil and lots to learn.

if you read any of my earlier posts on here you'll find I tried to garden in a veganic way (no manure) but waht i found was the soil just turned to dust (I have sandy soil) and would not hold moisture. Plants suffered.

I now realise that animals and their dung have always played an essential part in agriculture and so also in allotments. An allotment has to be an artificial concentration of nutrients in order for it to produce the crops we require.

[drmoonshine]

thanks learner ive only been on the plot for a few days now still getting to know people. feel alittle lost. being the new guy on the block plus i'm only 21 so feel like im being abit ''watched'' have to prove myself or something lol. ive probably been given the plot as im young and able to dig the thing with little effort or maybe less effort then someone older. the plot has become overgrown and needs proper TLC but i dont mind im just very glad i have finally got my own allotment now dont care what it takes to get the thing looking like everyone elses lol

[Paul Plots]

You lucky devil....... 21!! What a brilliant age to start. I wish I had taken more interest and had the time when I was 21. You have years and years ahead of you so stop worrying - experiment and enjoy each little bit that goes well..... and it will.

Being watched?
I thought that when I took over my dad's plot.... I really felt that every move I made would be laughed at quietly and I was nervous about planting the right thing at the right time at the right depth in the right way.....  

The truth is, if anyone watches, it's because they will want to pick up tips from things that you do!  

There will be so much advice on offer that (if you're not careful) they'll all be over telling you their way is best so in the end you won't get much done and it'll be so confusing.

Get yourself a decent book or two and learn which ways work best for you... try a bit at a time but keep at it regularly to keep what you have done in good order.

Best advice of all is... take it easy... enjoy...  
Best of luck (.......& keep asking & reading)


You certainly seem to know quite a bit about peppers 

[drmoonshine]

i got the green fingers from my dad but only now i am taking a proper interest in things when i was younger i did not give too hoots about what he did. i had ''better'' things to do. o how wrong i was lol. my dad in along time ago was in the papers for growing a record breaking onion but the guinness book of records would not submit him as he grow it from a set and not a seed. 

he still got 100's of pounds witch was alot of money in them days and was also in a few mags too

i like the fact that im the only one out of all my friends that is bothered about where my veg comes from and actully enjoys growing and tending my land. i was a chef up north a few years back before i moved to the midlands so i have a very good understanding of produce and what is best.

ps i made abit of a mistake in my last post im actully 22 

[Paul Plots]

i got the green fingers from my dad but only now i am taking a proper interest in things when i was younger i did not give too hoots about what he did. i had ''better'' things to do. o how wrong i was lol. my dad in along time ago was in the papers for growing a record breaking onion but the guinness book of records would not submit him as he grow it from a set and not a seed. 

he still got 100's of pounds witch was alot of money in them days and was also in a few mags too

i like the fact that im the only one out of all my friends that is bothered about where my veg comes from and actully enjoys growing and tending my land. i was a chef up north a few years back before i moved to the midlands so i have a very good understanding of produce and what is best.

ps i made abit of a mistake in my last post im actully 22 

22...... past it already 

[mike1987]

im only 22 awsell and sometimes get the feeling that every move i make and every plant i plant are been watched and dont even get the old boys started on my bed system with grass paths in between i could get anther 2 rows in every bed if it wasnt for them lol
but once they relise that you have some intention of staying and that you are willing to lend them a hand when they need it you will be accepted

[potatogrower]

you could try and do a deal with a local horse stable in your area, think its costs them to get rid of it, thats what i did so all you need is a fork and some strong bags. although its fresh you could use it in your compost heap along with the usual rotting veggies/grass cuttings and leave it a year. alternatively, you could just de-weed everything and put the manure on top and leave over winter then dig and turn over the soil in spring.  The manure in the garden centre might be expensive. I use to spend £7 on 3 yellow bags of horse manure with mushroom compost and i needed at least a good 15 or 20 bags of it for a good spread and they are only small 45 litre bags when compared to the compost bags that are 65 to 70 litre for £10 (not sure why they use litres  ).

I had seen a bag of manure based fertiziler called 6x fertilizer. its really strong stuff, can burn roots if used too much and really smells so you only need to use a couple of hand full for every square metre.

[noshed]

Ask around your site about manure. We get huge amounts delivered by the council contractors from the Queens Mews and the Met Police stables. We just charge people a couple of quid to take as much as they want. But this is fresh and you have to pile it up for a few months before you can spread it.
We also get council compost which you can put straight on the soil.
So before yopu spend any money see what the form is on your site - if necessary ring up the council allotment person and make some enquiries.
Good luck!