[pauly58]

hi all hoping to put garlic and shallotts in this weekend all autumn varieties  is it the right time i never believe the packet would sooner ask advice

cheers all

[gavinjconway]

I think maybe the clue is in your post - all autumn varieties... and it is autumn..  Why don't you believe the instructions on the packet? 

Do you get your car insurance done when you get the renewal?

Sorry for my corny comments but its a very strange post.

[pauly58]

yes they are corny comments was only asking advice please dont answer any of my questions ill wait for other people on here to rep;y

[finleyfreyaseth]

yea id get em in now why soil still warm,had my onions in bout 4wks now got lovely 6inches of growth and put my garlic in a fortnight ago and growth just peeping out the ground  :)more than happy as last year my garlic never even showed anything

[allotmentann]

Pauly, you are probably wise double checking. Seed packets, for example, give notoriously optimistic sowing times, because they give the range for the whole of the U.K., but if you live in Cornwall or Scotland the sowing times will be very different. Sow your tomato seeds in January in Scotland and you will be nursing some enormous plants on every window sill in your house by the time you can harden them off!
To be honest, I have more garlic to go in and I am starting to wonder if it is pushing it and they would be better in pots in the PT. I think maybe if I get a move on it will be okay.  I am not sure at what point it is too late myself. 

[AnneB]

Pauly, you are probably wise double checking. Seed packets, for example, give notoriously optimistic sowing times, because they give the range for the whole of the U.K., but if you live in Cornwall or Scotland the sowing times will be very different. Sow your tomato seeds in January in Scotland and you will be nursing some enormous plants on every window sill in your house by the time you can harden them off!
To be honest, I have more garlic to go in and I am starting to wonder if it is pushing it and they would be better in pots in the PT. I think maybe if I get a move on it will be okay.  I am not sure at what point it is too late myself. 

Have a look at this article from Alys Fowler at http://gu.com/p/2kbth   She reckons garlic planted in the first week in November, presumably in London, gave the best yields.

[allotmentann]

Thanks AnneB, that is interesting.   

[NickoV]

I have done trials planting garlic from october to April. One year I did a full bed in November and a full bed in Feb. By June they were pretty much the same size. I think there is something to be said for doing it like they do in the mid west of the USA. Get the cloves in before the winter but not so early that they produce top growth. Then they build a good root system over winter but are fully protected from the sub zero temps above ground. Then, when things start warming up in March or so, the top growth romps away. I have settled on the last week in October for us on the East coast of Lincolnshire.

[gavinjconway]

I have done trials planting garlic from october to April. One year I did a full bed in November and a full bed in Feb. By June they were pretty much the same size. I think there is something to be said for doing it like they do in the mid west of the USA. Get the cloves in before the winter but not so early that they produce top growth. Then they build a good root system over winter but are fully protected from the sub zero temps above ground. Then, when things start warming up in March or so, the top growth romps away. I have settled on the last week in October for us on the East coast of Lincolnshire.

Hi Nicko - you do get autumn and spring planting types.

[NickoV]

Hi Gavin,
I must admit to being a bit tight fisted and also eating loads of garlic, so I haven't ever bought a named variety of garlic from a garden centre .
Its interesting that you can get autumn and spring ones.  10 years ago I bought a fivers worth of bulbs from the produce section of an organic supermarket in Manchester. It said it had been grown in Yorkshire so I guessed it would be OK for our climate. I have been saving 'seed' bulbs from this stock ever since.
We reckon 300 bulbs is enough for us to have as much as we like, enough 'seed' for next year,and a few score to sell (going well at 50p a bulb at the local country market this year).
Growing this many means we can take apart a load of bulbs, plant just the big cloves and eat the smaller ones.I think it makes a real difference. People tend to be very impressed when they see the size of our garlic.
I put next years in yesterday.

[Steveharford]

Hi nicko. Pleased to meet another garlic fiend.  I like to grow loads and still trying to get the last lot in. I appreciate the idea of planting on the largest cloves and I strive to do the same but not as advanced in selection as you yet. I mix some fbb into the soil before planting. Also some sand and multipurpose compo as we are on clayey stuff. Do you put any extra feed in to start them off ? S

[Totty]

If your on poorly drained heavy soil, they will be prone to disease.
Get them In the ground now so long as you have nice well drained soil. Otherwise in my experience, it's a waste of time trying to nurse small plants through a hard winter if conditions are not perfect.

Try getting some in spring too, compare the difference, and I doubt you will bother planting onions or shallots in autumn again.

Totty

[finleyfreyaseth]

after my no show last year with garlic I dug a trench bout 5in wide and put a layer of grit,to aid drainage, then backfilled a bit then planted garlic and covered with soil bout 2 cloves deep at mo seems done trick.

[NickoV]

Hi nicko. Pleased to meet another garlic fiend.  I like to grow loads and still trying to get the last lot in. I appreciate the idea of planting on the largest cloves and I strive to do the same but not as advanced in selection as you yet. I mix some fbb into the soil before planting. Also some sand and multipurpose compo as we are on clayey stuff. Do you put any extra feed in to start them off ? S

We are on heavy clay but 11 years of no dig heavy mulch gardening has improved it some what.
We plant on semi raised beds following maincrop spuds. We don't use any fertilisers as such, just a mulch of rotted manure to the surface about 20mm thick in the autumn. As soon as the grass starts growing in spring we mulch between the plants with scythed grass cuttings, keeping it topped up through the growing season to prevent weed growth, evaporation, and give the worms something to chew on!

[NickoV]

If your on poorly drained heavy soil, they will be prone to disease.
Get them In the ground now so long as you have nice well drained soil. Otherwise in my experience, it's a waste of time trying to nurse small plants through a hard winter if conditions are not perfect.

Try getting some in spring too, compare the difference, and I doubt you will bother planting onions or shallots in autumn again.

Totty

I have never had much luck with autumn planted onions or shallots. Although last year I tried the method recommended by the Real Seed Catalogue of over wintering Sturon plants grown from seed. Slugs ate all but two of the plants! The two that did survive lasted the winter no problem but were not much earlier or bigger than the sets I  planted or seeds I sowed in the spring. I do hear of some people having more success. Maybe they are on lighter soil as you say.