Allotment Gardening Advice Help Chat

Growing => Growing FAQs and other Information => Topic started by: Digger Dave on May 02, 2007, 09:33

Title: Munty's runner bean frame
Post by: Digger Dave on May 02, 2007, 09:33
This thread is a discussion about Munty's Bean frame.


This is the basic design structure.

(http://i.imgur.com/ua71krk.jpg)

(https://i.pinimg.com/236x/cb/9b/d7/cb9bd794add12ba64e8631a587678d39--runner-beans-allotment-ideas.jpg)

edit to replace photobucket blocked photos
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on July 19, 2007, 22:44
Yup...  I'll take a piccy and post it  :!:

Here we are:

(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/Lesley-Jean/muntybeans3600.jpg)

The plants have not reached the top of the frame yet as the vertical plus diagonal length must be about 9 ft.

(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/Lesley-Jean/Muntybeans1600.jpg)

The trellises have sweet peas on them - just for fun  :D

(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/Lesley-Jean/muntybeans4600.jpg)

The beans dangle down and are very easy to find for picking.

(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/Lesley-Jean/muntybeans2600.jpg)

I have also grown a similar number of plant in the traditional double row A frame way and so far I would say I have picked 1 1/2 to 2 times more beans from the Munty frame.  I've probably picked about 15 lbs of beans so far :shock:  
You can't see from these pictures but the plants are flowering very heavily.

This is definitely the way I will always be growing my beans in the future. The old timers on our site are very impressed  :!:  
A big hug and kiss for Munty from Aunty  :!:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: BensGrandad on July 24, 2007, 03:34
My brother put some of those 2in thick poles up for my mothers beans one at each end and one across like a football goal and then put a net from the ground up and over the horizontal bar and  back to the ground but the weight of the bean plants, presumably, broke the bar.

Could one use net instead of string for constructing one of the types described here or would the weight again be too much for the standard pea/bean netting.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: loubylou29 on July 24, 2007, 07:52
That looks incredible. I can't wait to build one next year. Did you use bamboo canes in the horizontal and proper posts (i mean proper wood) for the vertical to make it a permant fixture?

Look fab I am jelous I didn't get one made this year!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on July 24, 2007, 14:55
Quote from: "loubylou29"
That looks incredible. I can't wait to build one next year. Did you use bamboo canes in the horizontal and proper posts (i mean proper wood) for the vertical to make it a permant fixture?


I used thick wooden stakes for the uprights driven into the ground.  I completed the basic frame with bamboo canes (as you can see in the photo of me constructing it) lashed together with cable ties.  I then tied hop string on for the beans to climb.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on August 02, 2007, 21:51
if you use netting the beans will gravitate to the easterly sun .... i know im gonna get stuffed by some " scientist type here but i learned from old timers that the peak growing period is from first sun till mid day  so 4 am in summer till 12  will make the beans stay on the string tracks and not go all over the netting to the west , but if its all you have use it,, i gaurantee you wil see a difference  :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on August 02, 2007, 21:53
now i had to put this in a seperate post as it would hav got lost in the other ......... im proud of all the frames and the results .i have a tear in my eye ,,,oh sorry its a skeeter ,well done all you wonderful folks  :)  incidently you can also grow lettuce etc under the frames remember  :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Shelle on August 05, 2007, 22:09
Two questions from me as a newcomer this year planning for the next year!

Firstly, can I grow peas using this method?

Secondly, I need to grow most things in containers and only have one small bed in the ground that I can use.  Can the method be adapted to using containers instead of the ground???  The bed I do have is long (ish) and thin, and unfortunately the north and south facing means that the length of the planted row would actually be the thin part (about mower and half width).  Do you reckon that is too thin, or should I try and adapt using containers on the paved area?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on August 05, 2007, 23:28
yes you can use it to do peas those funny shaped ones grow well on this frame i uszed a smaller version  a few years back to do just that unfortunatly my dogs decided it was a great place to jump and push through sniffing out rabbits etc and there is definatly no reason why you cant use containers to grow your beans etc ,deep ones are great
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Shelle on August 06, 2007, 17:27
Thanks for that!  Will try out peas ( no one in my family like beans but I loved the frame idea and felt so left out that I thought I could do peas instead  :D ).

Will try to work out a smaller version using containers.  How deep do you reckon and how many to a pot?  I am thinking 2, maybe too many or not enough???!!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on August 06, 2007, 21:45
10 litre containers  will do cut the tops off  drill half a doz holes with a drill 1/2 in the sides about 1 inch from the bottom . put 6 peas in a 4 inch pot plant them out in the tubs when they are about 6 inch tall and the weather allows  feed with a bit of growmore when they are about a foot tall :wink: water well when the tops dry
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Smudgeboy on September 14, 2007, 23:30
Bringing this back to life again - where Aunty had put trellises for Sweet Peas, could they be used for dwarf/French beans?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on September 14, 2007, 23:32
yes they can and they make an attractive show when they both flower ,great for a horrible fence etc
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Clodagh & Dick on October 04, 2007, 09:59
Spanish soil makes banging canes in tough so it's a must to have good solid supportr posts every two metres and guy ropes.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Tinbasher on October 16, 2007, 23:02
Quote from: "Lottie Lady"
Munty - I have tried to do the canes as you said but being a  girly 8 stone weakling I can't get the canes in deep enough - the soil is clay on the lottie( but it has just been rotovated again) I have even tried making the holes by hammering a shorter cane in  and it still doesn't work :( - any suggestions?


Rather than canes, which can bend and even snap when trying to force into clay sub-soil, I prefer to use round steel rods.  8mm diameter will do for shorter supports, 10mm will do for longer and 12mm is resilient stuff altogether.  I have some luxurious 16mm dia' ones, sawn at 8 foot each.

Being careful, you can usually force/twist the ends into most ground and can apply a hammer carefully to the tops in a way that you cannot with bamboo cane. Have the top ends bent right over and back on themselves for safety - only a couple of inches so they look like a mini shepherd's crook.  Closely hammered and this forms a useful top loop as well for string and such.  The ultimate is to have tiny 'arms' (say 2" of 6mm round bar) welded every foot or so (pointing up@ 45 degrees) along the above-soil length, for tying to and stopping string slippage down the rod.  There's no need to paint them in my view.  They'll last years and when rusted look ok in any case - Rustic in fact.

Just plain black mild steel bar will do.  Any local wrought-iron gate and fence manufacturer will have loads of it.  All the sizes I quoted above comes in 6 metre nominal lengths, usually a bit more for cut-off bad end allowance and such.  In other words (in old money) more or less 20 foot lengths.  So you can get 3 x 6' 6" lengths (in fact 2 metres - doh) out of a full bar, or 4 x 5' lengths or even 5 x 4' lengths.  Or 2 x 8 footers and a 4 footer.  Just ask the supplier to cut a length equally into however you want it - you're not fussy enough to an inch or so.  Have him bash the ends over - it's 30 seconds each with a vice and an anvil.  And a decent hammer of course.  Current prices should be about 5 or 6 quid per 6m bar for 12mm round, say 4 quid for 10mm and 2 or 3 quid for 8mm.

If they set the saw blade at 45 degrees too when cutting the base ends, you get a fairly sharp point (in fact a deadly one) to enter the ground even easier.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: arthur cooke on February 13, 2008, 11:25
I use a metal spike and a club hammer.
cheers arthur
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: beki on February 15, 2008, 14:39
We had a go at building one of these today. We're digging out beds etc in teh garden, and doing some fencing around it etc.

This is our first tie at growing our own veg (if you exclude our poor attempts at potatoes last year  :oops:  ) so please be gentle with me!  :lol:   :oops:  lol

We've probably done it all wrong.. but it's un-doable, so if we've not done it right, can someone point it out so we can fix it please?!  :wink:   :lol:

It's just a mini-one... about 4ft wide

(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l152/bekiboo26/100_3860-1.jpg)

beki xxxx
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: noshed on February 18, 2008, 12:20
Looks good - you need to get some good compost in there now.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 04, 2008, 21:19
Finished my MKII Munty frame today

(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff221/Aunt__Sally/MuntyframeMKII.jpg)

I'm trying a second for of lower strings so that I can plant a double row.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Sadgit on May 05, 2008, 09:12
does it need to be string? or can I use netting??
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Lardman on May 05, 2008, 11:12
I rather like the MK II , I built the MKI earlier this year and what really would have help were some measurements !!

I found it very difficult to judge the height of back and front posts. Space is limited as Im growing in the garden, so it had to be no more than 8 foot long.  I left the vertical posts 7 foot at the front and 4 foot at the back over a 5 foot span, then polly prop string every 6 inches.

This really only gives me 16 stations which is ok for breakfast but what about lunch and dinner ( I like runners  :D ) Very tempted to add a second row but Im concerned about access to the vertical section to pick. I notice you've reduced the vertical at the back to around 3 foot this year Aunty...
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 05, 2008, 15:08
It's about the same height as the one I built last year , about 3 ft at the back and just over 6 ft at the front.  

I'm not certain if the second row of beans is a good idea yet.  So I'd advice new Munty frame builders to stick to what Munty himself says and just have one row.  Time will tell  :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Trillium on May 05, 2008, 18:30
Quote from: "Sadgit"
does it need to be string? or can I use netting??


I was going to use netting myself until I reread Munty's instructions. Seems netting makes the vines wander and not produce as well. The string forces them up straight and into better production. And for best production orient the 'opening' of the frame to a S-SE direction for morning sun.

Wow, Aunty, you must really love runner beans.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: shaun on May 10, 2008, 21:45
and this is my effort and i'm sure it will work
 :wink:
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o152/shaungill/p110003.jpg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: matron on May 11, 2008, 06:23
Is that concrete reinforcing mesh Shaun? If it is OH has loads of that.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 11, 2008, 17:24
All planted up.  fingers crossed for warm nights  :wink:

(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff221/Aunt__Sally/beans11-5-08.jpg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: jacnal on May 12, 2008, 07:27
Looks fab Aunty. What will you grow underneath?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 12, 2008, 08:42
Not  sure Jac.  Probably some salads.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Snap Dragon on May 12, 2008, 14:48
That looks great Aunty :thumright: .... what distance have you left between each bean plant?

(I'm trying to work out how wide to make my frame!)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: jacnal on May 12, 2008, 21:29
And how tall are the posts?  :lol:  :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 12, 2008, 21:38
The short ones are about 3 ft out of the ground and the tall ones are about 6 ft out of the ground.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 12, 2008, 22:32
Quote from: "Snap Dragon"
Quote from: "Snap Dragon"
That looks great Aunty :thumright: .... what distance have you left between each bean plant?

(I'm trying to work out how wide to make my frame!)



I'm feeling left out now Aunty!  :cry:


Sorry SD I don't know.  about 9 " I think. I just use my trowel as a measurer when planting.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Snap Dragon on May 12, 2008, 22:37
Thanks Aunty....

I thought they looked quite close together. Someone had told me I needed to leave a foot minimum between beans. I had visions of my frame crossing the width of the plot!!  :lol:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: jazzbyrd on May 19, 2008, 18:47
Does anyone know what the X FRAME for growing runner beans looks like.  ? Someone posted on this thread that the x is tied in the middle and not at the top~~~ Is this stable ?

Jazzbyrd
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on May 23, 2008, 00:03
the x frame is a cross of wood .try branches of trees  :wink:  the strings are then tied to the upright points on both ends of the top sections . then hanging strings are then drop from these points so that you can infact have 2 lines of beans if you have a confined space .
this is a great idea , not mine i wish to add ,but  the munty frame is my pride and joy knowing that folks are using it ,please keep sending photo.s in of yours when built and then again when your picking your harvest  to the munty frame thread :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: She'sinthegarden on May 23, 2008, 23:06
Hi. Newbie alert! I was wondering whether - if I built the frame strongly enough-I could use it to grow a grapevine? I'd be training one stem up each 'string'.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Yorkie on May 23, 2008, 23:09
Ah.  Munty has a very sophisticated concept of an X frame....

The one I originally posted about is, er, an X - nothing more, nothing less  :oops:

On a traditional row of beans, the pairs of canes are tied together at the top, so you end up with a triangle cross-section.  The pairs of canes are then joined horizontally along the top with more canes.

The problem with that, if you're only 5'2" like me, is that it's hard to harvest the beans towards the top because they are hanging down inside the narrow point of the triangle, at height.

I either read about, or saw, the idea of tying the canes together in the middle - so the cross-section is like an X.  The horizontal bracing canes are where the X canes cross.  It would be far easier to draw it than describe it, except I always got Es for art... :cry:  

In this design, the higher beans are hanging down from the top half of the cane, thus being on the outside.

As for stability, ask me again in September  :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Yorkie on May 25, 2008, 18:39
Well, you did ask for basic ....

and given that I've never used Paint before, that's what you're getting!

Art was never my strong point  :oops:  (mind you, neither is IT  :lol: )

(http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll181/Yorkie1_photos/Xframe.jpg)

The traditional row of beanpoles is the top piccie; what I've constructed is the lower piccie.  The green line is where I am telling my beans they are to grow !
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on June 02, 2008, 16:02
Guess what's springing up on plots on my allotment site  :?:

(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff221/Aunt__Sally/Muntyframe2.jpg)

(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff221/Aunt__Sally/Muntyframe3.jpg)

Two of my neighbours have Munty Frames  :D
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on June 04, 2008, 21:36
actually it is patended but im werking on another version :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: She'sinthegarden on June 05, 2008, 21:29
Hi Munty
Will the other version you're working on be able to support a grapevine? I did grow runner beans a few years ago and I was dead chuffed with them until I realised that no one in our family can stand to eat them. :oops:
The neighbours got lucky that year :lol:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on June 07, 2008, 23:01
yes it will , but i cant say anything more on it til its produced .. i will hopefully offering that and a self assembly version of the " munty frame " for sale with  a large discount to members of this site ....a bit of paperwork to do first sorry  :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: iwantanallotment on June 09, 2008, 10:51
Quote from: "muntjac"
i will hopefully offering that and a self assembly version of the " munty frame " for sale


Brilliant idea! I for one would buy one.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: corndolly on June 12, 2008, 08:22
Sal , it is an amazing construction I agree, did nt finish it in time for the competition !

Planted some courgettes under it yesterday .

Will post pics when its covered with beans ,cant wait .
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: wurzelrob70 on June 28, 2008, 16:32
WOW! I was about to post a piccie of my Munty but have just seen Corndolly's. Feel kind of inadequate now :lol:
What can I say but way to go! It looks fantastic.

Well here's my scaled down effort anyway

(http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn29/wurzelrob70/P1000037.jpg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on July 03, 2008, 17:54
Beginning to flower nicely:

(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff221/Aunt__Sally/Beans1-7.jpg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: cawdor2001 on July 12, 2008, 10:18
My Munty frame has not worked that well, maybe i did not put enough tension on the string but they have blown all over the place and when the runners get to the top, instead of following the string they are snapping off  :cry:


Cawdor
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on July 12, 2008, 11:49
thats wind cawdor .try leading them around the strings ,,, werks for me  :wink: wind leftover right tho follow the suns track :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on July 22, 2008, 18:49
My beans are beginning to crop well now but I have to keep watering them  :!:

(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff221/Aunt__Sally/beans-07-08.jpg)

(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff221/Aunt__Sally/beans07-082.jpg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: corndolly on July 28, 2008, 21:06
A picture taken today, the rain tonight will help the plants loads. As you can see they are starting to go over the top. Lots of flowers .

Hoping the frame wont collapse !  

Picked 12  courgettes today , some for lunch and the rest frozen.

(http://threeroseshome.org.uk/runnerbeansjuly08.jpg)

(http://threeroseshome.org.uk/beansjuly08.jpg)

Will post more when the beans are growing !
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on July 28, 2008, 23:39
It's looking good.  

You may find you need to teach the beans how to climb the sloping roof.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: DD. on July 29, 2008, 06:07
In general peas won't climb by themselves though, unlike beans. You'd have to tie them up individually if you used this method, making a lot of effort for yourself. You'd also have to make a scaled down version that you couldn't walk under!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: cawdor2001 on July 29, 2008, 13:01
Corndolly, what have you tied your strings onto at the bottom?


Cawdor
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: DD. on July 29, 2008, 14:32
Surely the idea is that you don't have to tie the strings to anything?

You bury the ends as you put the plants in and when they start climbing they'll pull the string tight.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: corndolly on July 29, 2008, 19:52
That's Right DD . I put the string under each plant as I popped it into the soil.The bean seeds were sown in pots and transplanted . The string is extra strong type used around these parts for growing hops. I figured that if its strong enough for hops, it'll be Ok for beans. But I'm crossing my fingers , all the same , as its the first time we've grown runner beans this way.

Next year we will build Mark 2 , there are always improvements /adaptions that can be done.

What I have noticed this year is a lack of bees , Honey bees are suffering with viruses and Bumble bees too are struggling. This could affect the amount of beans that set , at the moment there are lots of flowers , the wind last night blew a fair few onto the ground but hopefully the beans will develop where they were.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: hecateh on September 02, 2008, 13:42
Just started 'growing my own' this year after being given a few surplus tom, cuke, pepper and butternut squash.

Looking for some forum support I found here and The Munty Frame' and decided to go for it, never having built anything from scratch before but being quite handy at the flatpack stuff.

Here's the result

Taken in June when just built
(http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j99/hecateh/garden%20veg%20and%20views/veg%20patch/july08002.jpg)

Starting to grow
(http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j99/hecateh/garden%20veg%20and%20views/veg%20patch/Aug82008garden013.jpg)

Starting to harvest
(http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j99/hecateh/garden%20veg%20and%20views/veg%20patch/PIC00013.jpg)

My family and friends are well impressed
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: muntjac on September 05, 2008, 08:50
Quote from: "alwayshopeful"
Munty - I am new to the forum and have loved reading your posts.  You are as entertaining as you are informative - I look forward to your next snippet of advice!!


sorry for late reply

 not just me but everybody has great input to the site thats why its the top allotment and gardening site in the country  :wink:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Gemma on September 15, 2008, 17:30
Hi,  Am new to the forums and have just come across this.  Having 3 children who LOVE runner beans I am going to have a go a building one of these in my garden.  Was wondering though given i dont have much space I will scale it down from some of the pictures we have seen here so that it fits in the area i have set aside for veggies,  But can i grow anything underneath it?  If not thats going to be a big bit of my patch gone to beans,  If i can use the space underneath then I should be ok.

Also can the back of the frame be against a fence?  or does the whole thing need to be open each side,  Again the only place i think i can put it is with its back to the fence
(http://photos-a.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v323/235/71/619950228/n619950228_1368584_4112.jpg)

This is the space im working with,  and thinking of putting this on the right hand side in the lower square part

Thanks
Gemma
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Bombers on September 15, 2008, 19:47
Gemma, I'll try and answer your questions, as I've experimented a bit this year with the world famous 'Munty frame' :)  I was told to try Lettuces and salad crops, but TBH I've had much better sucess with Parsnips!
       Re construction. I would personally use the back fence to fasten the string, and If you've got a spare sleeper, run it across the back  (it'll make it easier to pick the beans) It's just a lot easier if you can access from front and rear, or from both sides, without tripping over all your other lovely veg's :wink: But 'm sure other pp's will have some other similar/better suggestions. Good luck
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on September 29, 2008, 02:48
hecateh wrote:
Quote
When the beans started to get a bit heavy, and we got that wet and windy weather I added a small block of wood at the joints as well to make the structure a bit more rigid and able to stand up to the elements.


I've been thinking about going over to a Minty-style frame (like many others) but need to consider wind and weight of crop - as did you.

I use a mixture of steel posts and old pipe for my existing frame. It'll be an interesting winter task to have a Minty-frame (of sorts) ready for the spring so everyone else's ideas are really valuable.
Thanks. :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: FCG on September 29, 2008, 21:06
Would this work over a shed? Access isn't a problem.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on October 01, 2008, 02:16
Quote
Would this work over a shed? Access isn't a problem.


I am pretty sure the beans would be happy growing over a shed but would you be able to pick them if they were hanging down onto the roof?

Perhaps it is a very low shed and you are very tall? :?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on December 04, 2008, 22:18
We have quite a few useful topics available through this link:

http://www.chat.allotment-garden.org/viewtopic.php?t=3301
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Mr B on December 05, 2008, 14:33
Hi All,
   Just found the thread today, this looks a real winning idea but can some one tell me befor I build one if this is used in the same part of the plot each hear or is it dismantled and moved round with the 3 or 4 year rotation.
Chris
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: DD. on December 05, 2008, 14:38
You can suit yourself!

There are many folk who have a permanent been fence and just dig in more nutrients (muck), each year.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on December 05, 2008, 16:08
I move my frame around each year but my dad grew great beans on a frame in the same position for about 15 years.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Motivator on March 22, 2009, 20:08
What great idea this frame is , Just one darft question how close do you plant the beans
 together. Is it six inches as Munty says . Another darft question could i use normal nylon
 twine to string it up with . Will be having a go at Aunty's MK 2 frame. :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on March 22, 2009, 20:13
I move my frame around each year but my dad grew great beans on a frame in the same position for about 15 years.

My dad did exactly the same and I've used his frame for about 4 years adding compost and deep digging each year. This year I've dismantled the frame and plan to move to a new position - I'm going to try a "munty-frame" and keep my fingers crossed.  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: richyrich7 on March 22, 2009, 20:18
What great idea this frame is , Just one darft question how close do you plant the beans
 together. Is it six inches as Munty says . Another darft question could i use normal nylon
 twine to string it up with . Will be having a go at Aunty's MK 2 frame. :)

Munty's spacings are right, to be perfectly honest I don't think I've ever known him to be wrong, a real clever man and not in anyway "up himself"  You could try the nylon twine bung a few small knots in it if your worried they may slip.  :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on April 01, 2009, 15:27
In case anyone is thinking of using my MKII munty frame - DON'T !

It gave me no advantage last year over the beans I grew on Munty's standard design of a single row of beans.  I'll be sticking to that from now on.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: LivvyW on April 01, 2009, 22:37
Aunt Sally can you explain why you gained no advantage. I would have thought you could fit twice the number of plants.  I was planning to do your mk2 version also.

I'm going to try and post my first picture on my fave site.

This is my unstrung frame.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: monkeywobbler on April 02, 2009, 13:07
Hi guys - daft question (but then I am quite daft)

I read just now that the frame needs to face south - I have constructed a frame (looking marvellous, thanks munty), however I now have the horrible feeling that I have erected it the wrong way (in true monkeywobbler fashion).

The short stakes are facing south and the highest bit is facing north - please tell me that's right?!

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: matron on April 02, 2009, 18:02
Hi guys - daft question (but then I am quite daft)

I read just now that the frame needs to face south - I have constructed a frame (looking marvellous, thanks munty), however I now have the horrible feeling that I have erected it the wrong way (in true monkeywobbler fashion).

The short stakes are facing south and the highest bit is facing north - please tell me that's right?!





Hmmmmm, I am not absolutely sure but I think the short bits should be at the north bit and the long bits at the south bit. This is to encourage the plant to grow over the frame i.e head south. I could be very wrong about this but that was my impression.   :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: richyrich7 on April 02, 2009, 19:53
I've no idea monkeyw but I think they will get more sun your way.  :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: matron on April 02, 2009, 21:58
How this Muntjac  ( I could only find red string )

(http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/Lesley-Jean/Beanframe-1.jpg)


I was going off this drawing where the taller bits seemed to be at the south side. (If the drawing hasn't worked it is on page one).  :D
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: IanT on April 03, 2009, 20:30
Well my reasoning was the leaves would absorb most of the sun during the day - I hope I'm right!

I can see your reasoning but the think the original design was intended to maximise the usefulness of the ground area, minimising shade so other veg lettuce etc can be grown underneath.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: monkeywobbler on April 04, 2009, 10:22
Not to worry - I've erected another one in the opposite direction, so hopefully I'll be able to see which one produces the best crops. Thanks for the replies guys!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: matron on April 04, 2009, 12:07
Not to worry - I've erected another one in the opposite direction, so hopefully I'll be able to see which one produces the best crops. Thanks for the replies guys!

Let us know the results so that we can build the best producing way next year.  :D :D
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: robbodaveuk on April 06, 2009, 07:55
Well my reasoning was the leaves would absorb most of the sun during the day - I hope I'm right!

I can see your reasoning but the think the original design was intended to maximise the usefulness of the ground area, minimising shade so other veg lettuce etc can be grown underneath.

You can plant cauliflower underneath the north facing one, from what I have read, they do better when shaded.

  Robbo.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: garddwr on April 06, 2009, 19:29
Can you grow Climbing French Beans(cobra) up the munty frame ?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Bombers on April 06, 2009, 19:38
Can you grow Climbing French Beans(cobra) up the munty frame ?
Awww. Yass. That's what I grew last year, and will be doing again this year.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Quetzal on April 07, 2009, 20:44
I'd be very interested in knowing the results of growing facing north versus south.

I'm about to build my own version for the first time in the next coupla weeks. One question I have - a lot of allotmenteers around my way seem to build their (boring traditional) frames with a solid base of scaffolding poles or the like, and then add bamboo canes onto that base. With the munty style, how strong to my main supports need to be?

They have these things called 'plant supports' or something in homebase for a quid or two that seem to be some sort of thin metal with a plastic covering. Would that be strong enough to base my frame, or do i need to go more hardcore?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: zazen999 on April 07, 2009, 21:14
I put mine up a few weeks back, and they survived the winds we had. I've had broadies up it at the moment and they seem to be growing nicely, although once they are nearly done I will underplant with frenchies.

I put in 40 odd tall peas for the Garden Organic Members' Experiments today.

Hoping it is sturdy enough for all the climbing beans and peas I'm hoping to grow this year....
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: monkeywobbler on April 08, 2009, 17:39
Thanks for the tip Robbo - I hadn't really thought about it before and stuck salad bowl lettuce in the north facing one so I wouldn't be surprised if they don't like it there!
I will let everyone know what the yields are like from north v south facing, sometimes being daft has a use  :tongue2:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 08, 2009, 19:02
Great to see another munty-frame. Thanks, MoreWhisky. It looks good!  ;)
What height have you made the front and the rear uprights?

I love the child/rens play area too - a brilliant idea to give somewhere to dig and play. I would have loved that as a kid.  :)

Being nosy - Are those spuds you've got through already?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: MoreWhisky on April 08, 2009, 19:14
Thanks for your comments Learner  :)

6ft at front(8ft ploes) 4ft at rear(6ft poles) , i also used the same supports acroos the front and back 6ft ones.

Those plants are my strawberrys thats ive not moved from last yr but just tidyied them up abit , but i did swop a few of the older ones.

Glad u like the Childrens play area/Quarry made with scaffolding boards the same ones ive made my raised beds  with , works a treat.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 08, 2009, 19:42
Thanks for the dimensions - appreciated.

I think the children's quarry is a really great idea........ something that others would be pleased to copy I bet.  :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Ropster on April 09, 2009, 13:46
I will be putting mine up in a coupple of weeks when the purple sprouting has finnished.

What would happen it I grew one runner and one climbing french (cobra) bean up each string. do people think this would work or is it madness ?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 09, 2009, 14:03
I will be putting mine up in a coupple of weeks when the purple sprouting has finnished.

What would happen it I grew one runner and one climbing french (cobra) bean up each string. do people think this would work or is it madness ?

Sounds fine to me..... just as long as you can see which is which when you come to harvest.
I grew butternut squash on the same frame as runner beans last year... I can't think why you shouldn't mix-n-match different beans.

Like you I am waiting for my purple sprouting to "move over" so I can finish off the bean-frame  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: bluealf on April 11, 2009, 20:14
I have just built a mini "munty frame ô" just the one bay, it will be enough beans for us  :happy: i popped some tressle up the 5ft front posts for some pea's.

If work out how to do pics myself i will bore you with them sometime  :wacko:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: argaric on April 11, 2009, 20:44
Didn't wait for purple sprouting to finish put mine over it, by the time psb is done the benas will be ready to go in  :)

Regards,
  Argaric
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Celery on April 11, 2009, 21:40
I think I will have to give Munty frame a go.Do you think using wire ties would make it stonger.
           celery
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Digger Mum on April 12, 2009, 17:01
Call me stupid but which part of the frame should be facing South?
Tallest, wider part?
Shortest, wider part?
Or, one of the 'ends'?

I'm guessing tallest, wider part... Am I wrong?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: bluealf on April 12, 2009, 18:52
Call me stupid but which part of the frame should be facing South?
Tallest, wider part?
Shortest, wider part?
Or, one of the 'ends'?

I'm guessing tallest, wider part... Am I wrong?

Tallest part shoud be facing south, well acording to the original plans.

If not i have boo boobed  :lol:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: vetskh on April 12, 2009, 20:39
I am keen to try munty's bean frame design, but I was wondering what would fit in with my beds on the allotment. they are 6x1.5m with the narrow side facing south. This would mean having the frame only 1.5metres across which feels a bit short. does that sound ok to get a good crop of beans? Would the frame work as well rotated 90*?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 12, 2009, 22:04
Here's me chancing my arm but........

I have a feeling that a runner bean's sole intention is to get growing upwards if it can.... along the ground if it can't in search of anything to wind its way up.

Although growing it on a frame pointing in one particular direction might give the plant/s a bit of an advantage... I'm pretty sure they'll just keep growing up as far as they can no matter which direction a frame might be pointing. (I am pretty positive they are not going to claw at the ether in a vain hope of attaching themselves to something thatís not there growing north south or vice versa if there's something nearby even if it is in the wrong direction)  :blink:

I have almost everything lined up either across or along the line of my plot. I can't be doing with diagonals or off skews at wonky angles. I'm sure my plot lays SW / NE so my experimental Munty-frame is just going to have to line up with the outside edge of the plot and the runner beans like it or lump it.  :tongue2:

So... come harvest-time I will be regretting this firm minded attitude or simply saying, "Yep, mother nature is a wonderful thing! Despite our scientific interference it still copes!"
 
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Lee G on April 14, 2009, 13:44
Hooray for the North/South rebels!!

I have to confess I have no idea what way my plot or bean bed are aligned with the sun, I have enough work to do as it is  :ohmy:  So I have plodded on in the belief that as long as it shines, they won't care too much which way they are facing, as long as they can see the sun  8).  I'm adapting the bean bed I used last year and I had gazillions of lovely beans - I was giving them away left right and centre and eating them for every meal except breakfast - bean curries, soups, salads, you name it, I think I made it.

If anything, the only thing I want my munty frame to do, is to allow me to pick my beans without having to stick my head in a mass of dense foliage, especially as I am a bit of a wuss when it comes to getting creepy crawlies on my face  :tongue2:  :blush:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: monkeywobbler on April 15, 2009, 13:13
Right guys - this here is my munty frame.
One on the right is the first one and the one on the left is the second one. I have my doubts as to how sturdy they are but we shall see how well they do!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: kermit on April 15, 2009, 22:49
Ok, Im going to try a small Munty frame in my spanking new raised beds.  Space is tight so I love the idea of growing stuff underneath - what do you think would do best:  carrots, courgette or calabrese?  Or even peas?

The beds are about 1.2m wide (N-S) and 2.7m long (E-W), and over 2 feet deep.  Will also have (hopfeully!) fresh new topsoil, manure and compost. 3 beds with only one getting good sunlight, other two really partial shade.

I know salad crops have been recommended in the thread but I want to make the most of my sunniest bed, saving the cruddy shady bed for my salad.

Cheers
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: TheModfather on April 17, 2009, 18:23
Thought I might have a go at this. Its not fully completed yet and I'm doubtful that it would stand up in the strongest of winds but anyway...

(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg146/joe_douglas/17042009259.jpg)

When is the best time to plant these runner beans???

Cheers.

(Struggling to upload photos onto the post using Flikr - does anyone have any tips?)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: kermit on April 18, 2009, 08:15
Ok, Im going to try a small Munty frame in my spanking new raised beds.  Space is tight so I love the idea of growing stuff underneath - what do you think would do best:  carrots, courgette or calabrese?  Or even peas?

The beds are about 1.2m wide (N-S) and 2.7m long (E-W), and over 2 feet deep.  Will also have (hopfeully!) fresh new topsoil, manure and compost. 3 beds with only one getting good sunlight, other two really partial shade.

I know salad crops have been recommended in the thread but I want to make the most of my sunniest bed, saving the cruddy shady bed for my salad.

Cheers

Sorry to re-post, but any thoughts on what would do best under  my munty frame?   :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: bluealf on April 18, 2009, 10:42
Ok, Im going to try a small Munty frame in my spanking new raised beds.  Space is tight so I love the idea of growing stuff underneath - what do you think would do best:  carrots, courgette or calabrese?  Or even peas?

The beds are about 1.2m wide (N-S) and 2.7m long (E-W), and over 2 feet deep.  Will also have (hopfeully!) fresh new topsoil, manure and compost. 3 beds with only one getting good sunlight, other two really partial shade.

I know salad crops have been recommended in the thread but I want to make the most of my sunniest bed, saving the cruddy shady bed for my salad.

Cheers

Sorry to re-post, but any thoughts on what would do best under  my munty frame?   :)

I believe Salad's may work best and somebody said quick growing caulies.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on April 18, 2009, 10:52
I usually plant a couple of courgette plants under it - level with the front edge to give you space to stand to harvesting the beans.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: gawk on April 18, 2009, 11:36
I'm going to plant either courgettes or some salad crops under mine. I'm also going to plant a sunflower up against each of tallest poles ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 18, 2009, 12:19
I'm going to plant either courgettes or some salad crops under mine. I'm also going to plant a sunflower up against each of tallest poles ;)

Shove a butternut squash up the two tall posts.... trailing type. Tie them in to give them the right idea and they should share with the beans. Better crop from butternut than sunflower although maybe not so pretty?  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: mumofstig on April 18, 2009, 12:31
The point of the sunflowers is that they provide much needed support on a windy day...
Not a lot of people know this ::) :lol:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 18, 2009, 13:16
The point of the sunflowers is that they provide much needed support on a windy day...
Not a lot of people know this ::) :lol:

Sounds good -
 - but I am going for steel tubing for the frame (some of my sunflowers are dwarf varieties!)  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: kermit on April 18, 2009, 19:10
Great - some courgette it is.  Do you think peas would grow?  I'm thinking they'll get plenty light before the runners start going over the top, also with the open side being south facing?  Remember its a deep raised bed with plenty muck etc dug in.

Dont think I'll need sunflowers - going to screw my munty frame into my raised bed  ;)  Think I'll do some sweet peas up some side trellaces instead - they've gotta be the best value and nicest smelling cutting flowers you can grow!

Thanks folks.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 19, 2009, 00:10
Sweet-peas sound good Kermit.....check out Auntie's posting within this topic - she has a photo showing sweetpeas growing up trellis on the munty-frame.

I'm not sure about peas - I'm growing them with determination for the first time this year.. with luck! Only tried once before and it was a half-hearted effort so the results were patchy.0.. so can't comment on your idea / question.

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: lolabelle on April 19, 2009, 19:56
excuse me being a numpty
but will my borlotti climbing beans be ok on Muntys frame :unsure:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: DD. on April 19, 2009, 20:11
No reason why not, they grow in the same way.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Quetzal on April 19, 2009, 21:17
Great - some courgette it is.  Do you think peas would grow?  I'm thinking they'll get plenty light before the runners start going over the top, also with the open side being south facing?  Remember its a deep raised bed with plenty muck etc dug in.


I was thinking of growing some (non-climbing) beans using the free poles on the tall, open, south side, but I thought perhaps it would make it too hard to get at the runners once they get bigger - perhaps growing peas would be similar?

Anyway, I started putting mine into effect today. My wife remains skeptical about how strong i'll be able to make it...
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 20, 2009, 00:13
What concerns me is how the heck I am going to reach to the top of a gert big pole to bang the thing in the ground especially when it needs to be up-right.  :unsure:

I have decided mine will have to have some additional sloping supports somewhere. I've started by digging holes to put the up-rights into - then I'll hammer the steel poles downwards and pack soil into the holes..

I can't be doing with anything wobbly... occasionally we get quite high winds in late summer and lifting loads of beans back up is not an option...  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: argaric on April 20, 2009, 15:57
Learner,
  Don't make it too solid a bit of give is always a good thing in any structure  :)

Regards,
  Argaric
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: braders1234 on April 28, 2009, 12:53
Hi All,

I created a Munty's Frame last week.  I used those metal poles covered in plastic that I got from home base  as well as cable ties top tie together(£20 all in), has the advantage that I should be able to reuse.

Has created quite a stir on my allotment site, I have has quite a few enquiries and the guy next door to me who speaks to everyone said people have been comming up to ask him what I am doing!


just hope my seeds germinate in it now!

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: gawk on April 30, 2009, 19:28
Can I ask if this twine is ok to use on my forthcoming munty frame, it seems a bit thin to me?

LINK (http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=10278317&fh_view_size=10&fh_location=%2f%2fcatalog01%2fen_GB&fh_search=twine&fh_eds=%C3%9F&fh_refview=search&ts=1241115920857&isSearch=true)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on April 30, 2009, 20:30
The length and price look good - as far as I know.

Can't see why it shouldn't do a proper job....but I have yet to see how my Munty performs  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 02, 2009, 15:38
I have secured netting to my frame this year and the beans are on there way up they have only been in the ground a few day tand they are taking off. 

I hope you avoid a late sharp frost!  :(
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: mumofstig on May 02, 2009, 16:24
Should have had the last frost in this kneck of the woods but you never know ::)
Always worth the gamble i think cos it's easy enough to stick some more in direct if they do get nipped by frost.
I'm stringing the frame tomorrow, i hope, and then mine will go out..so fingers x'd
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 03, 2009, 01:55
Munty Frame:

I still have to tackle getting the uprights in..  How high are your tallest poles Quetzal?

I just can't figure out how I am going to reach the top to bash the poles in with a club hammer!  :blink:  :unsure:  :unsure:

Advice please.... ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: oldbean on May 03, 2009, 07:08
Quote from: Learner

I just can't figure out how I am going to reach the top to bash the poles in with a club hammer!  :blink:  :unsure:  :unsure:

Advice please.... ::)

I couldnt bash my hazel poles from the top even if I could get high enough. I used an iron bar to make a hole in the ground and just popped the poles in. With the spread of the four poles at the corners, it should be ok.

The poles /sticks were bits I cut out of the hedge I planted years ago.

Though the strings look a bit close, the beans are in two rows which will grow up alternate strings.

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Quetzal on May 03, 2009, 13:34
I did something similar - I made a hole with a smaller pole first, and then forced in the main uprights. I also cut my scaffolding poles diagonally to try to make them a bit pointy going into the ground. My poles are ~8ft and ~6ft, shoved in about 2ft to make ~6ft long poles and ~4ft short poles. It was pretty hard work getting them in though. It felt like i was going to give myself a hernia.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 03, 2009, 20:20
Thanks for responses:

So far I have dug down about 18" into the soil - looks like I am putting in fence posts!
I would still like to clamber up high enough to give the ends of the poles a few hefty whacks with a hammer - nothing to do with pent up aggression - just that I don't want the whole thing to slide sideways when it is windy.

I must stop dithering and get the munty up.... first runner-beans looking health and ready to go in their paper-pots.  ;)

Lovely looking rustic-engineering oldbean!  :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: harrymac on May 03, 2009, 20:59
I just can't figure out how I am going to reach the top to bash the poles in with a club hammer!  :blink:  :unsure:  :unsure:

I stood on a chair to get enough height for the taller poles. They were 8', with 2' bashed into the ground (though I probably could have got away with shorter ones as I also nailed the posts to the wooden sides of the bed).

It helps if you make a couple of saw cuts to the bottom end of each post to make them pointed.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Vienna Phil on May 03, 2009, 23:14
This looks great and I fully intend to try it this year. I was wondering though while the poles have to be of uneven height. Can anyone clarify?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: oldbean on May 04, 2009, 00:19
Learner, if you have poles 18" into the ground, it won't b shifting anywhere.  If you get winds that strong your beabs will be shredded before you pick them. A couple of bracing bars would stiffen the frame.

Vienna, if you read through from the beginning of the post it will become clear early on.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Sue32 on May 05, 2009, 10:17
couldn't quite visualise this - then realised it's less a hockey stick, more a bus shelter!
great idea.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: BILL251 on May 06, 2009, 19:33
    silly one     maybe  but  use  a  broom handle   instead  of  a  cane   to make your  hole,s
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: shaun on May 06, 2009, 19:35

munty frame MK 11  :)
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o152/shaungill/DSC00100.jpg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on May 07, 2009, 09:24

munty frame MK 11  :)
what did you stand on to take the picture, were you on the shed roof like me? How tall are the stakes at the back?
 I make a large shallow x shape (the 8ft canes cross about 4ft from the ground) for my beans so they also hang down easily for me to see and pick.
Oliver     
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: shaun on May 07, 2009, 20:57

munty frame MK 11  :)
what did you stand on to take the picture, were you on the shed roof like me? How tall are the stakes at the back?
 I make a large shallow x shape (the 8ft canes cross about 4ft from the ground) for my beans so they also hang down easily for me to see and pick.
Oliver     

i was on my tiptoes oliver ::)  the back posts are about 18" tall each bean plant will get a small cane all to its self,
to be honest i dont think its quite high enough at the front so i'm going to get 2 harris fence panels and lay them on top of the re-bar.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: lisajpickering on May 07, 2009, 22:58
Hi all

Gonna try mk1 on my plot this weekend - I've only been there a couple of weeks and I'm sure this will make an impression...    8)

Since I plan to make it a permanent structure, I'm thinking I'd like some permanent stuff growing underneath.  Does anyone think I'll have problems with blueberries, rhubarb or strawberries?  They'd have to be pretty near the front so I can get round them to harvest the beans but... well, what do you think?

Also, I've got a bit confused on the peas issue.  Would this technique work? Is it just that peas don't grow so high?

TIA
Lisa
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 07, 2009, 23:19

munty frame MK 11  :)
what did you stand on to take the picture, were you on the shed roof like me? How tall are the stakes at the back?
 I make a large shallow x shape (the 8ft canes cross about 4ft from the ground) for my beans so they also hang down easily for me to see and pick.
Oliver     

That sounds interesting but how do you get to pick the beans in the middle of the X ?

I think a munty is easier to pick from....  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on May 08, 2009, 09:52
Quote
That sounds interesting but how do you get to pick the beans in the middle of the X ?
I think a munty is easier to pick from....  ;)

An x doesn't have  middle  :unsure: well it does, but only where the canes cross.

This is a picture of a 'traditional' bean support - the poles are crossed, but high up.  In he broad x the canes are wider apart at the base, and they are crossed about 4 or 5ft up - where you see the yellow line. Any beans that are hidden in the leaves, you just ferret around! I move their site every year, but Fred (he's 96 you know) who had a plot below me uses his site every year, just adding more garden compost every time, or digging it out when it gets to full, and restocking the trench with garden compost and manure in the winter. There are many ways to do these things, so don't be daunted - do what suits you! I don't have a picture of a broad x. If I remember I will take one and post it up, if you are interested.
Oliver
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on May 08, 2009, 10:01
Since I plan to make it a permanent structure, I'm thinking I'd like some permanent stuff growing underneath.  Does anyone think I'll have problems with blueberries, rhubarb or strawberries?  They'd have to be pretty near the front so I can get round them to harvest the beans but... well, what do you think?

Also, I've got a bit confused on the peas issue.  Would this technique work? Is it just that peas don't grow so high?

TIA
Lisa
If you grow blueberries, make sure your soil is acidic - they hate chalky soil so you will get rubbish crops and waste your time (and money)
Rhubard - newly planted is very small, and takes about 3 years to start yielding. then it grows away for about 45 years (our is older than that) and gets about 6ft in diameter so depending how wide the mouth of your structure is, you will never get in there to sort your beans out!
Strawberries - I don't bother with them, all that netting, and we caught a blackbird once, so the birds eat what they need, but we hope we get there first!

Catch crops under the beans are probably a better bet? Or rows of leeks so they can over Winter.
What does Munty do?
Oliver
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on May 08, 2009, 12:09
Also, I've got a bit confused on the peas issue.  Would this technique work? Is it just that peas don't grow so high?
I read somewhere here that some peas grow very tall, so perhaps they would work? Short ones would probably waste the space. I don't grow peas anymore - can't beat the lodgers as I always forget to spray the flowers at the right time ...
Oliver
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Yorkie on May 18, 2009, 18:11
I used an X frame last year with the middle of the X at just below shoulder height, far easier to pick than where the tops of the canes are joined - but probably not as easy as a Munty (didn't have room for that this year).

Don't suppose you can borrow a post rammer?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: richyrich7 on May 18, 2009, 20:49
Shove your spade right in where you want to put the post's and give it a wiggle, then try putting the posts in.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: strangerachael on May 18, 2009, 22:42
Mmm. I did try digging a hole and wiggling the fork down at the bottom of it, but still no joy. I have to get the beans in by the end of this week as we are going away on Saturday, so I will just have to do what is easiest. The Munty might have to wait another year...
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 19, 2009, 00:03
I dug down to make what looked like fence-post holes, rammed the posts in as best I could then back filled. (Did think of pouring in a can of water and waiting a bit to soften the clay but didn't need to). On the shorter posts I could reach easily to hammer them in a good way too.

If you have time now it might be worth it in the long run to make picking faster later.  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: gawk on May 19, 2009, 07:43
I dug 2 ft deep holes for each of my 6 posts, back filled and firmed down with my feet as I went, this was done during the dry spell but wasn't too difficult. The holes should be easier to dig now the ground is wetter.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: vetskh on May 22, 2009, 10:26
I've finally managed to get around to building my bean frame, Munty's style, but was hoping to use half for runners and half for clinmbin french bean (cobra and poss blauhilde), does anyone know if its a problem to plant these close together with pollination??
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on May 22, 2009, 11:39
I always plant my Runners and Climbing French beans next to each other - i.e. left end of the row is Runners, right end of the row is French Beans.  I've not had a problem with the ones in the middle misbehaving!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on May 22, 2009, 11:41
I've finally managed to get around to building my bean frame, Munty's style, but was hoping to use half for runners and half for clinmbin french bean (cobra and poss blauhilde), does anyone know if its a problem to plant these close together with pollination??
I would say its only a problem with pollination if you are going to save the seed so grow more beans. Could be an interesting variation if they cross-pollinate?
Oliver
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: HLS on May 22, 2009, 12:13
The Real Seed company has information on saving all sorts of seed here: http://www.realseeds.co.uk/seedsavinginfo.html

They seem concerned with runners crossing with runners, or french beans crossing with french beans, so I'd assume they don't cross with each other.  My family grow runners near dwarf french beans in their garden and they've never had a problem, either.  On the other hand, it sounds like you may have problems if you're on an open site with other people growing beans.  I've only saved seeds from beans grown in a back garden, so I don't know how much of a problem that would be.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 22, 2009, 18:07
I would be surprised if there was a problem with cross pollination of different types of beans.

I can see that different varieties of runner bean would cross pollinate but not so sure runners would cross with dwarf french so readily if at all.

If they do you might be in for an RHS award and loads of profit from breeding a new strain - doubtful though!  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Lardman on May 25, 2009, 22:11
Question Re roof string spacing.

The O.B.N.D. tells me that my strings are too close together, as a result the beans wont "fall" down across the roof but rather get tangled up in the string and the bean vine.

I see his point - I've got string every 5-6 inches whats the group thoughts about this ?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 25, 2009, 22:30


The O.B.N.D. 

What's that mean dear ?
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Lardman on May 25, 2009, 22:32


The O.B.N.D. 

What's that mean dear ?

"The Old Bloke Next Door" ... surely everyone has one  :D
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 26, 2009, 01:38
This OBND thinks 5" to 6" apart for strings is fine.  :)

It's not as if the beans are suddenly going to appear full length then drop down or get tangled up. They will develop gradually and gravity will pull them downwards from the earliest of stages.

Stick to 5 or 6 inches and I think it'll be fine.  ;)

(Famous last words?)  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 26, 2009, 06:44
This old biddy puts the strings on her "Munty Frame" about 6-8 inches apart and to be honest it is a little too close as the thick mat of leaves tends to catch up a few of the beans ans stop them dangling.  It's not a problem though as they are easy just to see from the top and just push through,

In BM times ("Before Munty") when we used an "A" frame the spacing was wider to give access for picking to the beans on the inside of the frame.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on May 26, 2009, 08:09
... OBND tells me that my strings are too close together, as a result the beans wont "fall" down across the roof but rather get tangled up in the string and the bean
I am afraid I would agree with them, he or she - I grow mine beans 10" apart, BUT - the only answer is wait and see. You've done it now. If its not ok, you won't do it again!  :blink: But keep us posted so we know to make them closer next year if necessary :D
Oliver

PS Everything is growing like mad now - gentle rain last night again -  luverly. Just watch those slugs and snail on dem beans - they love tender juicy shoots and this rain is just the sort of weather they like.  However, if they do kill a bean, is not too late to put another seed in. In fact, the timing is ideal now because the soil is nice and warm. O :happy:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 26, 2009, 17:19
Now you go and tell me Aunty!!   :blush:

I've been and gone and stuck my (almost) upright strings at 6" intervals as that is how close the bean plants are...  :(

Oh well.... I used the same spacings as I had on BM version (conventional 'A' frame).

I have yet to put the "over-head" strings in place so maybe I ought to let the plants converge / share strings once they are up and on their way over??  :blink:  :unsure:

Complicated all this planning and thinking!!  :blink:

It certainly seemed to take me ages to fiddle and knot and plant.... a longer performance than the old 'A' frame that had been in the same place for about 15 years.

We'll see..... learning from personal experience is the best way I guess....even if a fair few of those personal experiences are mistakes  ???
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Lardman on May 26, 2009, 17:44
.... puts the strings on her "Munty Frame" about 6-8 inches apart and to be honest it is a little too close as the thick mat of leaves tends to catch up a few of the beans ans stop them dangling. 

Thats what was worrying me.

It's not a problem though as they are easy just to see from the top and just push through

mmm 8ft high frame somehow I don't think thats going to work.  I've removed 1/2 the roof canes so they're now 10"ish apart leaving the verticals at 5"

Might use the canes for some French beans in a mini Munty if they ever germinate.  :(
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 26, 2009, 17:52
They'll be fine however you grow them !

The most important thing is the soil preparation with lots of rich humus and copious watering throughout the growing season.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 26, 2009, 17:54
The idea with the munty frame is that you don't need to have it too high.  the back supports about 2' 6" to 3' high and the front supports about 6' high
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: mumofstig on May 26, 2009, 18:10
from my experience it doesn't seem to matter if they are 6in or 10in apart .....they still all end up in a huge tangle at the top :lol: :lol:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 26, 2009, 18:12
Nip them out when they reach the top.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: mumofstig on May 26, 2009, 18:17
nipping out will increase the number of new shoots from lower down, which grow up to flower and increase yield (and increase the tangle at the top) :lol: :lol:
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 26, 2009, 18:18
there's always one smart @rse  :lol: ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Motivator on May 26, 2009, 18:38
I would think nipping them out would help a fair bit. I could be wrong. ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on May 31, 2009, 14:49
"before finding this site i had already planted my beans"

Have you already put a "traditional" A-frame of canes in?

If so perhaps you could lower the cross over point of the canes to make an X with a low crossing point, more of a:

|\       /|
 |\     /|
  |\   /|
   |\ /|
     x
    / \

so that beans will dangle outside the frame, rather than inside as-with the traditional A-frame
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 31, 2009, 14:58
"before finding this site i had already planted my beans"

Have you already put a "traditional" A-frame of canes in?

If so perhaps you could lower the cross over point of the canes to make an X with a low crossing point, more of a:

\       /
 \     /
  \   /
   \ /
    x
   / \

so that beans will dangle outside the frame, rather than inside as-with the traditional A-frame

Several people seem to use this set-up but I still wonder how you get to see or reach the beans on the inside of the V.......or will they all oblige by hanging out?  ???

Either way they will grow with a bit of luck!! (and some bees....)  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on May 31, 2009, 15:06
"will they all oblige by hanging out?"

That's basically it.  Same as they hang-in on an A-frame.  Some can get stuck the wrong side, but in general not.

(I've modified my original diagram, so it now has beans!!)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on May 31, 2009, 15:18
...... 't beans will dangle outside the frame, rather than inside as-with the traditional A-frame
brilliant drawing Kirsten! This is what I always do (or an A frame if HE helps ...) Have been doing this for xxx years! so it works - a bean's gotta do what a bean's gotta do, so don't worry about it. East is fine too - you will soon find what is best. (We plant everything North to South - OBND plants E to W, so only one face gets the South sun - but his works too :blink:)
Oliver
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 31, 2009, 16:15
If you arrange your canes in the X format make sure you tie them together at the top to prevent collapse.

______
\       /
 \     /
  \   /
   \ /
    x
   / \
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Yorkie on May 31, 2009, 17:00
I'd put one or two plants at the base of each cane - so either 11 or 22 canes for the uprights, plus a few for the cross-pieces (depending on length of purchased canes, length of the row, and how much cross-bracing you plan to do)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Lee G on May 31, 2009, 22:54
So here it is!!

(http://chat.allotment-garden.org/gallery/5203_31_05_09_9_48_18.jpeg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on June 01, 2009, 01:06
With luck - a photo of my first ever Munty bean-frame taken a couple of weeks ago.  :)

I planted some early beans at the far end and put up some cover for frost protection.

More recently I've added a short seed-bed row of wallflowers, lettuce and some courgettes underneath. I am hoping I have judged it right and there'll be enough room to wander around picking the beans!  :unsure:

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on June 21, 2009, 16:44
... It is actually smaller than it looks in the pic.
I had a thought for all Munty-users: a 'Snapper'

These pruners have long handles and a cut and hold mechanism which is ideal for pruning and deadheading. He has one and loves using it.  You can reach over stuff planted under your Munty to pick the beans.  Just a thought
Oliver
(take a look at the website for a picture: http://www.carryongardening.org.uk/shop/long-reach-pruners
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Casey76 on June 21, 2009, 19:05
Well here is my attempt!

(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/oconnka4/Garden/Gettingthere.jpg)

I just hope it can cope with the wind lol
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Quetzal on June 24, 2009, 21:54
it's a bit hard to see, but my first bean has got onto the top string. I'm a little concerned about the amount of bushy growth at the bottom, and the 'stringyness' of the main vines, however:

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_51OgiSjq7vA/SkJIKerPfdI/AAAAAAAAAHc/6aFZd6qkDV0/s400/DSC00083.JPG)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on June 24, 2009, 21:57
That looks great.  Nip the top out when  when it reaches the top of the strings and they will bush out to fill your frame :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: MoreWhisky on June 24, 2009, 22:03
Im a bit worryed mine wont cling to the roof now that they have reached the top of the back 4ft wall.

Everbody is watchin my frame with intrest, already had ppl planning on making one next yr if mine works.

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on June 24, 2009, 23:24
Im a bit worryed mine wont cling to the roof now that they have reached the top of the back 4ft wall.

Everbody is watchin my frame with intrest, already had ppl planning on making one next yr if mine works.



Sounds as if my runners are a spit in front of yours.... (or my lower side is lower than yours) - as my  beans are romping away along the "roof". Spotted two tiny beans this evening.  :)

The bottom of my plants, like yours, are really bushy but they are getting the idea - "up, up and away"  ;) and....they are coping with an onslaught of blackfly  :( (early this year?).

I've had just one comment from neighbouring plot holders = "I see you've tried a new bean-frame." But I have had others taking a new route across the allotments and my paths are getting more wear than usual!!  :lol:

Perhaps muntys will be spring up around me next year - if I don't knock myself out or get strangled scrabbling about underneath the frame when the beans are big enough to pick!  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Oliver on June 25, 2009, 16:08
Quote
Perhaps muntys will be spring(ing) up around me next year

My friend had a poly tunnel for many years but when she stopped using it the 'skin' fell to bits which left the frame. She has threaded the frame with string and has a perfect 'munty' for her beans. She has been growing beans like this for years and says it's very easy to pick the beans, and it looks nice, although a bit problematical if you plant stuff under the beans - you must look where you walk, or tramp on stuff!  :D
Oliver
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: harrymac on July 04, 2009, 23:06
I forgot to add that I've already had beetroot, intercropped with spring onions, in the same bed as the runners. As this will be a brassica bed next year I'll shortly be planting some purple sprouting broccoli in their place. Yet more good reasons to have a Munty frame. :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: MoreWhisky on July 09, 2009, 22:11
My first plant has now grown to the top of the 'roof' , thats 10ft im amazed.

Now do i top the plant or something?

Im growing lettuces , Spring onions , beetroot  amd butternut squashes under mine. All seem to be doing very well to.

Ive also grown sweet peas up the bottom corners and put my sun flowers growing up the front 2 posts so its looking a real nice structure.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on July 09, 2009, 22:21
I don't think I'd nip out the tips.... but I imagine others will disagree. Usually I just let my beans roam about and find a place to hang on to and continue growing where they wish.  :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: DD. on July 14, 2009, 11:15
Wouldn't have thought it matters which string they grew along, the idea is the beans hang down.

There's no way my beans grow up the cane I plant them by! They average themselves out.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Quetzal on July 22, 2009, 19:14
i have to admit, i imagined that it would be a case of 1 vine per plant, point them in the right direction, and off they go, whereas there are multiple vines per plant, and they seem to like jumping from string to string a lot more than growing up their allocated line.

I've pinched the tips out of the vines which have reached the top, but they keep growing.

I'm still a little concerned about the bushiness at the bottom.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_51OgiSjq7vA/SmdNiZLPqJI/AAAAAAAAALs/iTKPJ7tWkVY/s1600/Image0121.jpg)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on July 22, 2009, 19:20
There's not much flower either Quetzal  :(

Have you been feeding them ?  Too much feed will produce lots of leaves and not much flower. 

I only feed mine if they are going a bit pale before they flower.  As soon as they start to flower I use tomato fertiliser on them once every 10 days or so.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on July 23, 2009, 01:27
I never feed mine once they have been planted - they start off a few inches above a deep trench of rotted compost - have a sprinkling of chicken pellets as they are dunked from pot to plot and then it's water, water and more water.

It seems to work for me... well, for them I mean.  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Quetzal on July 23, 2009, 09:48
i think i fed them once. i was hoping the flower would come in due course.

There are actually two types of bean - runners on one side and borlotto beans on the other.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on August 15, 2009, 12:16
Despite the more than average rainfall I think runner beans may have been a bit on the dry side (in my region) if not watered carefully inbetween down-pours.

I've found my row of beans (that have grown like a thick privet hedge) have sometimes been surprisingly dry just below the soil surface so have watered them. Where I haven't (it's a long row) the beans have tended to be a bit as you described.

If you dug in lots of compost last autumn and added a bit of feed to the soil at planting time I don't think you should have gone wrong.

I never pinch out the tops though.... just let them get on with it as nature intended (??)

Better luck next year - but I think you will still get a crop this year... the lower flower often tends to give way to flower higher up as the season goes on.  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on August 15, 2009, 12:53
I'm lucky as my allotment plot was once my dad's and he turned the hefty clay into the most wonderful friable soil by adding compost and farmyard manure for 50 years.

As your mum did - he added anything that was organic (so would rot down) into the bottom of the bean-trench... newspaper was a favourite as was anything else that once lived... not including ex-members of the family though!!   :tongue2:  ::)  ;)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: sunshineband on August 15, 2009, 13:21
This year our bean area had masses of rotted /part rotted leaves from last autumn dug in, together with shredded paper. It has several gallons of water twice a week, even if it has been raining, because like Learner said, the leaf cover is so dense that not a lot of rain gets through the the soil.

Ours is not like Munty's though --- the children made two wigwams about 4 ft tall only  ::) (very sturdy  :lol: ) so now the beans are draping down and  trailing across anyhting in their wake  :D :D Looks hilarious but there are at least plenty of them  :D

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on August 15, 2009, 13:39
This year our bean area had masses of rotted /part rotted leaves from last autumn dug in, together with shredded paper. It has several gallons of water twice a week, even if it has been raining, because like Learner said, the leaf cover is so dense that not a lot of rain gets through the the soil.

Ours is not like Munty's though --- the children made two wigwams about 4 ft tall only  ::) (very sturdy  :lol: ) so now the beans are draping down and  trailing across anyhting in their wake  :D :D Looks hilarious but there are at least plenty of them  :D



Too be perfectly honest my Munty-frame (experiment) has not been 100% successful!!
My fault - my father grew many more bean seedlings than I/we actually needed to plant 1/2 an acre and I planted the lot!!  ::) He loves growing things and I couldn't say "thanks" and then not use them.......

Result: ........ while one end of my 30' long munty-frame is mostly successful the other 20' (!!!!) looks like a wide, pretty privet hedge of about 4' high and 3' in depth. The beans have not managed to grow up and over the frame but have lost their way amongst the other competing beans and tangled into the most amazing 4' high jungle!!

The other slight????? problem is, where the beans have made their way up and over and have pods hanging beuatifully & impressively down from above - some twit decided to make the best of the land below the frame and planted several very rampant courgettes and the traditional (for me) butternut squash. Results is = an interesting performance reaching the beans no matter where and how I try.

So.... I have learned that next year I will:

And.... not put the beans too close to the rasperries so as to leave room to get between them speedily....

And listen to my OH when she says, "There are just so many beans a family / friends / neighbours can eat in one year....and accept that "we" will not be freezing any again this year.....as "we" prefer to eat them in season and when they are fresh.....apparently  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Smarty on August 17, 2009, 14:59
My Munty frame has been a brilliant success too, although never having grown beans before I don't really have a comparison.

Made a mistake with mine though....planted sunflowers at each upright. Whilst this looked pretty earlier in the season some of the beans decided to take off up the sunflowers. Checking the seed packet again I realised that 'Russian Giant' are biggies. They are currently about 10 feet tall and until I very cruelly cut them off yesterday, had bean stalks (with beans!) waving madly at the top of them!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on August 26, 2009, 20:06
Learner - I made the same mistake under planting  - mine were winter caulis so there is netting involved too ...  Didnt realise how big how early.  Duh!   ::)

Courgette fatigue came to my rescue..... :) The early yellow ones have gradually stopped producing so out they came and onto the compost heap.  ;) Now I can get at all the beans without hunting for a place to stick my feet amongst the foliage.

Green courgettes, planted later, are taking the place of the yellow ones so we're still picking and slicing. My runner-bean-hedge continues to bloom and show little enthusiasm for dashing off up the strings...  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Quetzal on August 28, 2009, 22:46
Celeriac under the frame = success.
Squash under the frame = disaster. I can't really get at the frame to pick the beans, the squash has grown so much.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: MoreWhisky on September 02, 2009, 09:24
Beetroot under frame total success
Spring onions got about 5 lol
Butternut squash still going )
lettuce sucessfull

Tbh the frame has been to sucessfull go so many runners cant give them away.
Are runners beans ok to go in the compost bin? and yes i have tried giving loads away ppl are getting sick of me asking now.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: JayG on September 07, 2009, 15:54
I wish I had joined this forum at the beginning of the year as this thread would have saved a lot of back pain and maybe even given me a decent bean crop.  Will be trying this frame next year though, so thanks for the idea. :)

Constructed a semi-permanent Munty frame out of angle iron this year and it has worked well.

It's a good way to train runner beans without them getting tangled up at the top of "wigwams" or inverted "V" formations, and of course access for picking is much easier.

Soil preparation is still the most important consideration for a good crop though.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Auntie Rain on September 13, 2009, 08:19
Am seriously considering an alternative to the Munty frame - how about using an old rotary clothes line? Plant half a doz plants around the upright & train around the top!

It must be worth it just to see the reaction of the neighbours when it first goes in.....  :D
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on September 13, 2009, 23:43
Am seriously considering an alternative to the Munty frame - how about using an old rotary clothes line? Plant half a doz plants around the upright & train around the top!

It must be worth it just to see the reaction of the neighbours when it first goes in.....  :D


Sounds novel - plants will need loads of water and nutrients that close together though..
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: HLS on September 14, 2009, 14:37
Am seriously considering an alternative to the Munty frame - how about using an old rotary clothes line? Plant half a doz plants around the upright & train around the top!

It must be worth it just to see the reaction of the neighbours when it first goes in.....  :D


You'd have to stop it rotating, though, or it would chop the tops off on windy days!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: grgh on September 14, 2009, 14:41
You could always use a circular raised bed on wheels.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Lenny59 on January 07, 2010, 21:19
Call me stupid but do you have to keep twisting the runner bean plants round the string as they grow???? Cheers for any replies in advance....Lenny
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: andtiggertoo on February 01, 2010, 20:10
OK, think I'm going to join the ranks of munty frame users this year. Really need some advice on what materials to use so would be grateful to share your experiences.

Have read through the marathon 38 pages and decided that bamboo canes are probably not up to the job. As i'm working with a 4 bed raised veg plot ( each bed is 13ft by 4ft4) I want a portable version, so I can rotate. Therefore the sturdy wooden frames I have seen and much admired on here would be a shame to dismantle and reassemble every year.

Have been looking at some aluminium tubing available from gardening-naturally ( am i allowed to mention the company ?). The tubing is designed for crop protection cages. Not sure if they will be robust enough or not, the uprights are 16mm diameter, and cross bars are 13mm diameter. The uprights on the long side of the frame will require extentions to reach the 6 foot height required by the munty frame. This will add some strength as the tubes fit together with 5cm of one pole fitting inside the other pole.

I don't intend to go into mass production on the bean front so I was thinking of a 6 foot maximum length to the frame. But I shall need extentions on the cross bars as well just to get the frame longer than 4 foot.

Think the project is going to cost around £25. Not exactly cheap but if it's robust enough to get a few years out of it I would be OK with that.

So what do you all think ?

Thanks for any advice offered.

Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: kermit on February 01, 2010, 20:28
I got 4 2x2 treated wooden sticks from B&Q - 2m in length.  Cut a couple of feet of two of them for the short side.  Then used other decent bits of timber i had lying around for the two connectors.  Finally, two more pieces of strong timber to complete the square on the short sides (I added these later as the weight pulled the two sides together!).  If you're going for a long munty, you may need 6 of the long poles (ie for the middle) - mine was about 2m in length and since I used strong supports between the poles, it worked fine.

Easily dismantled (just fixed with wood screws) and waiting for use again this year  8)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: andtiggertoo on February 01, 2010, 22:00
Thanks for the advice Kermit, I'm not too good at screwing wood together. I managed to make my wooden raised beds by hammering nails in but they aren't going anywhere in the foreseeable future.

I was hoping to avoid screws and nails for this project if they have to be dismantled again. Sorry if that's a bit lightweight, but I suspect if i used wood and screws it would be a very shambolic affair  :blush:- nothing at all like Aunt sally's splendid photo's in page 1 !!
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on February 01, 2010, 22:10
And Aunty fixes her frame together with cable ties - easy peasy :)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on February 01, 2010, 22:36
I used some very old (bean on the plot for years) galvanised steel poles for uprights tied with string and a cheap nylon washing-line to connect the whole lote together.... It worked well.

But.... this year I must plant fewer bean plants as they tangled in places and made a hedge before they grew over the top!!  ::)
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: kermit on February 02, 2010, 20:10
Thanks for the advice Kermit, I'm not too good at screwing wood together. I managed to make my wooden raised beds by hammering nails in but they aren't going anywhere in the foreseeable future.

I was hoping to avoid screws and nails for this project if they have to be dismantled again. Sorry if that's a bit lightweight, but I suspect if i used wood and screws it would be a very shambolic affair  :blush:- nothing at all like Aunt sally's splendid photo's in page 1 !!

Its really not difficult, especially if you have an electric screwdriver / drill bit.  Just put at least two wood screws in at each point of contact.  Probably easier than nails!.

you should see my raised beds (pics on here somewhere) - now they were a nightmare, using coach bolts, but well worth it.

Im sure cable ties would work fine though.
Title: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Trillium on February 02, 2010, 20:20
I put mine up with woodscrews as they won't pop out in extreme cold. Being either lazy or too busy, I simply leave mine up all year and this is year 3 and they're just fine. I too used 2x2s (spruce), but I also used them as cross braces at the tops, then 2 side braces for more rigidness. Nylon string is their lead line and that stays up year round as well. My cukes discovered them this past year and happily climbed to the top.

Did everyone see Aunt Sally's final pic on pg 3?
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Snoop on February 08, 2010, 16:06
Absolutely love this frame - thanks Munty! But I have a question concerning the space between plants: I've been longing to try some Merveille/Meraviglia/Marvel of Venice (take your pick - I've seen loads of versions of the name of these beans and have no idea which one is more common) but on looking at the packet of seeds I've got, it says plant seeds 50 cm apart in rows 60 cm apart. I've never grown climbing beans before, but does 50 cm sound right? I'd need nigh on a football pitch to get a decent number or plants on a frame.

Thanks for any advice.
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: madcat on February 08, 2010, 17:21
Mine go in about 4 inches apart...  10 cms apart. Two rows of them, like in the picture. 50cms would be daft!   :ohmy:  Do you think it might have been 5 inches and someone cant do the conversion?   :D
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Snoop on February 09, 2010, 12:10
Thanks for the reply. I thought it seemed odd. The box is in Spanish and Portuguese, plus there's a diagram, and they all say rows 60 cm apart and 50 cm between seeds in each row. I'll definitely be giving them and Munty's frame a go.
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: scabs on March 07, 2010, 13:55
I've just built my frame, stood back to admire it, shown it off proudly to fellow plot holders... But I'm sitting here looking at it and suddenly realised: the short side is actually a little over 5ft tall. The high side is probably about 7ft...

Have I gone too large?
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: madcat on March 07, 2010, 14:06
That sounds like mine!  How long is it?
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on March 07, 2010, 14:12
I've just built my frame, stood back to admire it, shown it off proudly to fellow plot holders... But I'm sitting here looking at it and suddenly realised: the short side is actually a little over 5ft tall. The high side is probably about 7ft...

Have I gone too large?

Sounds ok to me providing your runners run fast enough up and over... beats having to scrabble round on the soil picking from the lower side...  ;)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: scabs on March 07, 2010, 14:35
Hi, I hope so!

I guess it's about a 7ft row by about 5ft deep.

Much larger than I had envisaged, but I got carried away.
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: PennyS on March 23, 2010, 18:53
The problem i have is I have Raised beds and am unable to get the frame to face south, what would be the best alternative ?
Mmm I have a similar problem in that ideally the way round that I'd have my frame sited, the "open" face would face north.  So the sun would be strongest on the upper side of the frame IYSWIM.  What's the concensus - is this a really bad idea or might I get away with it?
 
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on March 24, 2010, 07:17
That's what you want, isn't it? Sloping roof facing South and the mid day sun?

Beans hanging down on the shady side - although you will be looking into the sun if you pick them at midday!
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: digalotty on March 24, 2010, 11:15
i want to build a munty so i was wondering as everyone has built theres over a a bed and then planted something fast under to get an early crop, why not build it on the edge of the bed so that the beans hang over the path, instead of walking on the soil to pick the beans you have a nice path and room the other side to put your broad beans in first.
 
does this make sense
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: chopkins1313 on March 24, 2010, 12:11
that's what I've done with mine, looks a treat!
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on March 24, 2010, 19:05
My beds ... are aligned north-south, widthwise east-west. To make the most of the length of the bed, which side should be the open side - east or west? I presume east to make the most of the early morning sun.
Interested in other people's views as to whether Morning or Evening sun is more beneficial?

My view is that they are same /similar and I would pick most beans in Afternoon or Evening and I wouldn't want to be looking into the sun, so I would plant East facing (morning sun benefit) so as to have the sun behind me when picking!
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Trillium on March 24, 2010, 19:10
Munty's original findings were that the slightly south east facing light yielded the best crops. Mine face more south with a slight tilt to the east and I'm overwhelmed with runners. I put lettuce under my frame for a quick catch crop, then basil.
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: jdwmk on March 24, 2010, 21:57
Hi

I built a Munty bean frame on my plot this weekend.  Can't wait to see the beans growing up it.  Will try to take a photo of it and post it when I can.  What I do know is that it has sparked a lot of interest up at the allotment !  My neighbour was telling me today that she's had a number of people asking her what it is we have constructed   :D  I think they think the newbies are a bit daft  :lol:

We are planning to plant a couple of pumpkin plants under our frame - does that sound OK ?  ???
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: digalotty on March 24, 2010, 22:11
you will be dancing round them as you try and pick your beans
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: PennyS on March 24, 2010, 23:43
i want to build a munty so i was wondering as everyone has built theres over a a bed and then planted something fast under to get an early crop, why not build it on the edge of the bed so that the beans hang over the path, instead of walking on the soil to pick the beans you have a nice path and room the other side to put your broad beans in first.
 
does this make sense
Absolutely!  I have been considering growing mine so they hang over my "patio" bit to give us some shade in this blistering summer we're going to have! :D
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: trogg on April 30, 2010, 12:16
Hi all, I have this week built my 'munty' frame, the only real problem I have is the longer posts are 8 foot high, is this too high ?
I've had a few comments about it, "are you building a football/rugby pitch" etc  :tongue2:
I'm quite tall so reaching the beans wont be a problem for me but will the beans actually make it to the top ?
I think they'll have to travel about 10 foot from the ground to the top of the frame  :blink:
Or should I just reduce the hight of the frame, easily done but it would be nice to leave it as it is and prove a point  :tongue2:

 :)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Swing Swang on April 30, 2010, 12:41
beans can grow 10'
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: trogg on April 30, 2010, 13:14
Thanks, that's put my mind at rest  :)

Might even put some hanging baskets across the top  ;)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: PennyS on April 30, 2010, 18:58
Thanks, that's put my mind at rest  :)

Might even put some hanging baskets across the top  ;)

Actually that's not a bad idea!  I'm making my MuntyFrame(tm) this weekend and it's going to be right by my "sitting area" .  I could put some nice hanging baskets there!!
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: PennyS on May 09, 2010, 21:40
Help!

I have been wanting to put up my MuntyFrame(tm) for weeks now and got OH to come down to the lotty today to help me.  I've got myself some nice solid treated timber (think it was 30mm x 30mm or so), but he had a paddy about being able to put drive the timbers in deep enough to really anchor them.   Our site can tend to be a bit windy.

Me being a bit of a bodger, had simply planned to bash in a shorter pole with a sledgehammer to make a good pole hole, then take that out and put the proper one in.  He reckons if I do that I won't be able to get the shorter pole out again.   At one point he mentioned postcrete but I pointed out that I want to be able to move this around for next year!

How do you guys fix your taller poles in securely?



Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Ice on May 09, 2010, 21:52
PennyS, I thought that this particular bean frame was meant to be permanent and there was no need to move it next year. 
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: PennyS on May 09, 2010, 21:54
Ah thank you,  I've completely misunderstood then!  So OH wasn't completely doolally when he started talking metposts and stuff.

I might leave it until next year in case this isn't the right place to put it, the plans are still in a bit of flux ....

Bamboo canes it is then.  Might just do a lightweight version of the Munty in bamboo, if that works...

Thank you!
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on May 09, 2010, 22:25
I do a X-Frame, rather than a A-Frame, which is a sort of poor-man's-Munty and also temporary, so more easily growing beans in a rotation scheme.

An A-Frame joins the canes at/near the top, whereas on my X-Frame the canes cross about 1/3rd of the way up. Just 2/3rds of the cane length the beans dangle-down on the outside of the X-frame, rather than hiding on the inside of an A-Frame.

(You need to bind the tops of the XFrame canes so they don't get caught by the wind, like an A-Frame, and also to cross-brace the outer sides of the X-0Frame so the weight of the beans doesn't pull the frame down :)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on May 10, 2010, 07:42
Here's a picture - before I decided I needed cross-bracing, but you've got the idea I'm sure

http://chat.allotment-garden.org/index.php?topic=38109.msg453850#msg453850
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Spana on May 14, 2010, 16:28
Mines made out of scaffolding :)

(http://i41.tinypic.com/2n19sh3.jpg)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 14, 2010, 20:09
Scaffolding  :ohmy:

Your real name's not JACK is it ?  :lol:
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Spana on May 14, 2010, 20:49
Scaffolding  :ohmy:

Your real name's not JACK is it ?  :lol:

 :lol:

Its been up 9 years so you can say its long lasting.  Every couple of years OH unscrews the connections and moves it 2-3ft back , forward or to one side or the other, so i get different ground to plant into. :) it does me OK :)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Aunt Sally on May 14, 2010, 21:06
It's brilliant  :D
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Salmo on May 15, 2010, 00:39
I have read through the postings and the advice is that the frame should face south. I may be a little slow on the uptake but does that mean the short poles are south or the long ones?
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Trillium on May 15, 2010, 00:54
The long ones.
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Kristen on May 15, 2010, 09:41
OK, I'm being thick here.

If the short-poles were at the South side wouldn't the sloping upper face be towards the South, and the leaves growing up it get more sun?

Or doesn't that actually make any difference, and having the Long poles on the South side means that things growing under the Munty frame get some daylight?
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Spana on May 15, 2010, 09:51
The runner tips will always go towards the sun.  So if you have the short poles at the south side the runners would go up and then lean away from the top, if you get my drift. :lol: 
With the high pole on the south side, the leader goes up the short side string then leans towards the sun-the south- and over the top :)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: JayG on May 15, 2010, 09:53
Good thinking, Kristen!

I've never quite understood that aspect of it myself but having tried it the recommended way I can say that it works, the best thing about it being that the plants don't all finish up in a congested tangle at the top and of course most (but not all!) of the beans just hang there waiting to be picked! Don't forget to plant any spare plants next to the long poles; even more beans!

(Spana has just come in with an explanation but I'll post this anyway!)  :)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: KT on May 16, 2010, 09:33
Quick question, on the bean frame when you tie in the strings and let them hang down do you attach them to something on the floor? or just leave them free hanging?
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: PennyS on May 16, 2010, 10:05
Quick question, on the bean frame when you tie in the strings and let them hang down do you attach them to something on the floor? or just leave them free hanging?
I think on the Munty type frame (tm)  you tie all the strings to a long beanpole to anchor it, and peg that to the ground. 
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: JayG on May 16, 2010, 11:08
Quick question, on the bean frame when you tie in the strings and let them hang down do you attach them to something on the floor? or just leave them free hanging?

I use galvanised wire cut into suitable lengths, straightened out apart from a "U" loop at one end which is hooked over the horizontal pole, the other end is pushed into the soil.

Simple, can't flap about, re-useable, and makes taking down the bines at the end of the season much easier (just pull on the loops and leave the plants behind!)

(Not quite telling the truth here by the way, my Munty frame is made from angle-iron so I drilled holes in the cross-member to insert the wires, although having worn out several drill-bits and my drill sharpener, on reflection I didn't really need to do that!)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Spana on May 16, 2010, 11:12
Quick question, on the bean frame when you tie in the strings and let them hang down do you attach them to something on the floor? or just leave them free hanging?

If you are using string, fix the bottom pole up from the ground a little so you can get your hand and the string under.  Saves a lot of grazed knuckles :)
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2q1trac.jpg)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Paul Plots on May 16, 2010, 14:37
Quick question, on the bean frame when you tie in the strings and let them hang down do you attach them to something on the floor? or just leave them free hanging?

I use galvanised wire cut into suitable lengths, straightened out apart from a "U" loop at one end which is hooked over the horizontal pole, the other end is pushed into the soil.

Simple, can't flap about, re-useable, and makes taking down the bines at the end of the season much easier (just pull on the loops and leave the plants behind!)

(Not quite telling the truth here by the way, my Munty frame is made from angle-iron so I drilled holes in the cross-member to insert the wires, although having worn out several drill-bits and my drill sharpener, on reflection I didn't really need to do that!)

Sounds sensible thinking to me - I love "easy" / time efficient.... saves miles of string too.  ;)
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Spana on May 16, 2010, 15:10
Does the wire get hot in the sun :unsure:
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: JayG on May 16, 2010, 22:03
Does the wire get hot in the sun :unsure:

Why should it?

a) It is quite light coloured and shiny so would reflect most of the sun's heat, b) even if it didn't it would conduct the heat away into the soil,  c) it's supposed to be smothered in bean bines!), d) what sun are you referring to; am I missing something?   :nowink:
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Spana on May 16, 2010, 22:29
Does the wire get hot in the sun :unsure:

d) what sun are you referring to; am I missing something?   :nowink:

 :lol:

Its just that i put some wires on a south facing post for a clematis to climb and they get really hot :blink:
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: JayG on May 16, 2010, 22:38

 :lol:
Its just that i put some wires on a south facing post for a clematis to climb and they get really hot :blink:

What colour is your wire? Dark colours absorb radiation much more than light colours (try touching a black-painted piece of wood in the sun and then a white piece.)

Can only reassure you that my beans do not come off the plants pre-cooked!
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: Spana on May 16, 2010, 23:16
ah... :wub: its that silvery wire that florists use :wub:
Title: Re: Munty's one way to grow runner beans
Post by: 1jim on May 17, 2010, 09:18
I am going to try and build one of these this year,
Is 2x2 pressure treated timber ok (its cheaper than the 3x3stuff or would this be better)
I was planning on buying 12foot long timber and cutting to size, planned 6foot tall piece and the short one being around 3 foot with about a foot and a half on each bit below ground if that makes sense- will that be enough to hold them in place?

I see on some pictures some people are using bamboo canes as the bottom tie for the sting, is this ok or do I need some more 2x2timber to brace the frame and use this as an anchor as well?

thanks
jim
Title: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Stratts on April 10, 2012, 20:57
Hi guys I have built my Munty frame but am not sure of a couple of things.

Here it is with the high side facing SE ish!

(http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x203/bigstratts/Lotty/Photo0623.jpg)

I'm going to plant runners in 1 half and climbing french in t'other 9 a side but would they be better planted inside or outside the frame? 

(http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x203/bigstratts/Lotty/Photo0639.jpg)

I've got the weed membrane down inside for ease but do you think dwarf beans would be ok on the inside cut through the membrane?

I've also planted 6 broad bean plants along one end on the outside but am not sure if that was a good idea?  What say you?

Cheers
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: prakash_mib on April 10, 2012, 21:42
sorry to crash your idea and i may be wrong.
shouldn't the short side be facing south east? the plats are going to grow from that side.
my word that looks sturdy (you can grow pigs on it and they wouldnt fall. good job).
 underneath you can grow salad crops but again you have two turn the sides.
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Stratts on April 10, 2012, 21:50
That'd be about right coz I built it the other way round and turned it coz I thought it was wrong, lol!!

It's not a big job to move around as I've screwed the corners to stakes in the ground so swung 180 degrees it should still fit between them.  The membrane is stapled to the bottom timber so that would move with it!

I've built it so the whole thing can be lifted along the plot when I rotate the crops  ;)

It's got the tongues wagging coz they've never seen owt like it on the lotty.  My neigbour said funny place to build a greenhouse, lol!!   :lol:
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: mumofstig on April 10, 2012, 21:58
with the tall front edge to the south you get enough light under the frame to grow stuff like salads or courgettes ;)

Sketch from original  Munty Frame thread ;)
http://chat.allotment-garden.org/index.php?topic=50801.msg402866#msg402866

Aunt Sally's looks lush with the beans and some sweetpeas on the front  :D
http://chat.allotment-garden.org/index.php?topic=50801.msg76525#msg76525




edit to fix link
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: gazza975526570 on April 10, 2012, 21:58
Looks a good solid sturcture that.  :)

Thinking i may do one this year - as you say the old boys down the site wont have a clue what its for and im sure they wont approve!!!!
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: JayG on April 10, 2012, 22:01
Looks like a good arrangement to me Stratts. There's always some sort of compromise but the young beans will get good light when they are small and anything grown underneath will also get the best of the available light (the beans will be OK once they climb up the diagonals because even facing north-ish there's plenty of light available in high summer.)  :)
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: prakash_mib on April 10, 2012, 22:03
so I was certainly wrong then  :lol:
I am going to build one this weekend you know which end will face the sun now  :)
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Stratts on April 10, 2012, 22:09
That's a relief cheers and just checked google earth and the high end actually faces SW so I got it wrong.  I also didn't want it blowing away, lol!!

Never thought of courgettes under there that'd save a bit of space on my plot as I only need to grow 2 or 3 plants.  Maybe still have room for a couple of dwarf beans too.

What about the broad beans on the end is that ok or should I move them?  they are south facing on the outside,

Cheers
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Trillium on April 11, 2012, 02:40
One extra piece I added was to nail on a cross bar low down at the back bottom, but about 2 inches above the base. This way I can tie my string onto that anchor bar and up and over and onto the high top front piece. I find every few years I must replace the baler twine I use (not UV resistant but durable while it lasts) and the anchor bar makes things much easier.

Inside or outside for the beans is up to the user.

I personally wouldn't do broadbeans at the end since they get very tall and bushy and will make picking of runners harder than need be, plus competition for light and nutrients. A courgette or two under the the frame would work but don't get too carried away - you still need to get under there to pick the hanging beans.
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Stratts on April 11, 2012, 06:58
Ok thanks mate good idea bout the bottom rail. 

I'll move the beans coz thinking about it they would block light coming in the side for the courgettes as they are on the south end!!

I can see another smaller frame being built for them, lol!!
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Trillium on April 11, 2012, 19:39
I find the runners yield so well that I use half for runner beans, half for cucumbers which just love that frame.
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Stratts on April 11, 2012, 23:01
I was going to do half runners and half climbing french as the frame is around 13ft long and will give me about 8 stations per side.

A second  frame would be good for half broad beans and half cucumbers too with enough room under both for marrow, courgette, squash and dwarf french maybe.

Time to get the drill and saw out me thinks!!  :D
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: shokkyy on April 11, 2012, 23:31
I like the idea of the frame, but just trying to work out how much more space this would take up, in comparison to a conventional double cane row. Taking Aunty's dimensions as an example, which is 6 foot high at the front and 3 foot at the back, what would be the distance between the back of the frame and the front? Is it 6 foot, so equal to the height of the highest side?
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Trillium on April 11, 2012, 23:39
Not sure what the others did, but I made mine 6ft high at the front (so I wouldn't bash my head), about 2-1/2 ft high at the back, width about 4ft thereabouts, and the depth is somewhere around 2-1/2 ft. Definitely less than 3ft. I'd measure but it's just too cold to go out right now.

I wanted max surface area taking up the least space. And it was the wood I had at the time. It's been up for about 6 years now and going strong.
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: agapanthus on April 12, 2012, 00:01
Munty reckons it's a goodun!!!  8)
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: shokkyy on April 12, 2012, 01:36
Not sure what the others did, but I made mine 6ft high at the front (so I wouldn't bash my head), about 2-1/2 ft high at the back, width about 4ft thereabouts, and the depth is somewhere around 2-1/2 ft. Definitely less than 3ft. I'd measure but it's just too cold to go out right now.

Oh, that doesn't sound so bad. The idea of using 6ft of space to grow half the number of plants I could fit in a 2ft wide double row didn't sound such a good swap. Do you do one plant per string or two?

With last year's dreadful weather I didn't get a very good crop at all so this year I've done a double cane row just under 10ft long, which at 2 plants per cane gives me a whopping total of 60 plants. Hopefully I should be drowning in runner beans this year. But next year I might give the frame a go. Actually, I do already have a very sturdy timber frame fence running round that bed, and I suspect I could probably get away with using the timber frame as the back part of the munty. It would have to face due south, west or east though.
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Stratts on April 12, 2012, 08:12
The dimensions of my frame are 3ft high at back, 6ft high at front, 4ft wide with the angled roof sections 5ft long, giving total growing length of 8ft before they need nipping off.

I figured you'd need the same width to grow 2 rows taking into account getting down each side to pick and wiith a frame you can grow stuff underneath  ;)
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: JayG on April 12, 2012, 08:44
Mine has exactly the same height, depth and diagonal dimensions as Stratt's, although it's constructed from angle iron and is only 6 foot wide (everything has to be scaled down in my garden!) A total growing length of 8' for the uprights and diagonals seems about right as runners rarely grow taller than that.

As for density of planting, I've found an average of about 1 1/2 plants per string is about the best compromise between yield and overcrowding.

As for growing crops underneath, I strategically dump a paving slab so I can step over any crops without damaging them to pick the beans whilst maximising the growing space (obviously with a wider frame you would need more than one slab.)
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: Aunt Sally on April 12, 2012, 08:48
You can plant uner it too. Salad catch crops intil the beans start producing is a good idea.  I've even grown a courgette plant under it.
Title: Re: Munty bean frame questions
Post by: mumofstig on April 12, 2012, 09:32
but make sure you don't plant too much...........you still have to get to the underside to pick the beans  ;)
Title: Re: Munty's runner bean frame
Post by: Aunt Sally on April 12, 2012, 09:37
... Salad catch crops until the beans start producing is a good idea. ...

That's why salads are a good idea :)
Title: Re: Munty's runner bean frame
Post by: JayG on April 12, 2012, 09:58
....and access for picking is what the paving slab is for!  :)
Title: Re: Munty's runner bean frame
Post by: Dopey113 on April 28, 2013, 16:53
Just starting to build mine this week... 1/2 done (the 3ft high bit) as soon as I get my string I will finish it off
Title: Re: Munty's runner bean frame
Post by: Dopey113 on May 01, 2013, 18:42
All done

(http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a3/groundengineer/004-10_zps7ad95cec.jpg) (http://s8.photobucket.com/user/groundengineer/media/004-10_zps7ad95cec.jpg.html)