[Ice]

I made some French country bread today.  The recipe worked really well but the texture is too fluffy.  I prefer a firmer textured bread and wondered if there is anything I can do to develop the gluten more. 

Yes, I did use my new toy to knead the dough.

[Aunt Sally]

I think we need a taste to be able to give you advice on that 

[Ice]

Here, have a smell.  Samples have been pm'd.

[mumofstig]

Did you add any salt .......... salt strengthens gluten......

Salt is usually added to bread to improve flavor and affect the character of the dough. A small amount of salt reduces the rate of fermentation appropiately, allowing time for the development of flavor compounds and the strengthening of the gluten. It is said that salt has a tightening effect on the proteins, permitting them to stretch without breaking. Some salt also promotes the activity of amylases and inhibits the action of proteases which are responsible for hydrolyzing flour proteins.
Too much salt has a similar osmotic effect as excess sugar, in that it limits the amount of water and nutrients that may be taken up by the yeast cells. No salt produces a dough which is sticky and hard to handle, due to the action of proteases on the flour proteins. There is also a weakened gluten which allows overexpansion of gases during fermentation due to the extremely rapid fermentation which takes place in the absence of salt. As the dough bakes, the gas cells may rupture and result in a bread with a coarse crumb and flat flavor.

Just a thought :blink:

[Aunt Sally]

Looks like a good crumb to me.

[Ice]

It does have salt in it.  Could it be that I should knead it for longer?  It does look superb, I must say but I'm a bit of perfectionist when it comes to cooking and baking.

[Aunt Sally]

You could try increasing the kneeding time.

[jennyb]

what about slightly less water/liquid?

[Ice]

what about slightly less water/liquid?

I'll have to experiment until I get it right.  Unfortunately it takes 2 to 3 days to get the starter going.  This could take some time.

[Poolfield2]

what about slightly less water/liquid?

I'll have to experiment until I get it right.  Unfortunately it takes 2 to 3 days to get the starter going.  This could take some time.

Does it take that long from a saved starter? The one I use, once it is active I can use it evry day.

[Ice]

I'm a bit new to this whole starter thing.  I had a sourdough one that was great until I used metal utensils.  I was just following a recipe in a book, but the idea of keeping a starter is a good one.

[Poolfield2]

The general rule is that once you have got a starter going that each day you take out some to use and put back the same amout of flour and water to feed it. I find that I don't bake bread every day and you can keep a pot of starter in the fridge. If it's in there for for 24/48 hours it will work once back to room temp. If you keep it for longer, you need to dig a bit of the gunge from the bottom of the jar (it will be underneath some grey liquid-yuk!) and put it into more fresh flour and water and build up the starter again.

By using the gunge instead of starting again the flavour develops.

[Ice]

Thanks Pooly, if I can get one going again I will be a happy bunny.  Sourdough is my absolute favourite bread.

[andreadon]

re: the salt thing - i read that adding salt at the same time as yeast has an adverse effect - if you use re-activated yeast (y'know, the one you make with water in a cup first then throw in) then you can add the salt to the flour and mix it in before adding the yeast mix.

my bread's normally stodgy, so maybe it does work!
 

[Ice]

I should have this worked out by Christmas.