[skewball]

Hello, vegetable growing virgin here!

I have read a fair bit about all this as I like to be as prepared as I can! (or at least I think I am prepared). But, I am realistic to know that with a family and busy working life I will have to be realistic about what I can achieve, especially to start with as my time will be constrained. Within reason therefore I will have to take (and look for!) short cuts. But this whole business is a bit daunting as the amount of advice/detail in mags and books is enormous! But I am certainly keen and like to do things properly.

The upshot is that I would be very very grateful if you could look at my ‘plan’ and tell me where I am going wrong, or what I’m missing!!

I am planning on keeping up a veg plot in my garden next year. We are having some work done on the garden over the next few weeks and the end result will be space (about 6m x 5m) that I will turn into, say, 2 or 3 beds for veg, separated by gravel paths.

I’m feeling ok about this at the moment, I hired a cultivator about a month ago as the area was effectively ‘waste land’ and now the soil is pretty bare as I managed to get rid of most of the weeds and churn up the soil quite nicely. Once the beds have been ‘defined’ with some wood edging and gravel I will then add manure/compost to the soil and do a little bit of digging as inevitably it will get trampled on a bit. Not much point before then (due to work being done). This should all be done by Christmas.

What to plant? I’m also fairly comfortable with this. My wife has steered me into what she would like (!) and I certainly know what the children like/don’t like, add to that advice I have read about what is easy/hard to grow on this forum. The upshot is that I will concentrate on Runner beans/beetroot/early potatoes/Leeks/parsnips/Courgettes/sweetcorn/Shallots and then a few bits and pieces that take my fancy!
Then, for me, comes the really tricky part and where I get confused!!

Firstly I should say that part for the fun for me will be choosing exactly what varieties I like from seed catalogues etc.
My wife is of the opinion that I should just go to car boot sales in the spring, buy plants, stick ‘em in and see what happens!!
This is probably what I should do to start with! (Will prob end up doing a little of this anyway)

So, assuming that I do order some seeds then I need the easiest way to plant seeds and end up with them in the plot growing. I have no green house etc. I also have no conservatory and only one or two south facing windows.

So, do I

During the spring concentrate on getting my plot as good as I can – lots of weeding (my area is going to grow weeds/grass like crazy!), add plenty of compost and try to get as nice soil as possible so that when the warm weather arrives then I just ‘chuck’ the seeds in the ground, in situ (following instructions!) and take it from there – thinning out etc.

But I see disadvantages:
1/ Will need to have very good soil to get the seeds to grow and will need to be able to tell them apart from the weeds!
2/ Will end up with lots of veg at the same time, fairly late in the season (?)
3/ Some plants will really struggle seeding in situ?
4/ the main one for me – I will not be able to plant seeds until late April/may!!  How will I be able to last!!


So, the other alternative is to effectively speed up nature and get a head start by sowing March time (?). I would like to try this!
But, I don’t have huge amounts of time and don’t want to invest lots of money at this stage and have no green house etc.

I have researched into this and I have a plan…!!

1/ Buy some trays and lots of 3 inch pots. Plant seeds straight into these pots.
2/ Propagate: sheet of glass over trays of pots in a warm place in the house.
3/ When growth starts buy a cheap ‘mini greenhouse’ (4 tier unit with plastic cloth – readily available for £20) and stick all said trays into it. Leave on patio.
5/ once plants are coming on well then plant directly out.

This seems doable in terms of effort and expense. But will it work….!!!???

ANY advice would be very very welcome!

Cheers!

[Salmo]

A lot of advice will depend on where you are and what sort of climate you have. The best way to guide us on this is to enter your location on your profile. County is sufficient.

[skewball]

Done.

My veg plot will not be the sunniest the world has ever seen. And the soil is on the 'clay' side although is pretty much PH neutral.

[JayG]

WOW! How many questions is that?!!

Totally agree with your choice of veg to grow in the first year; they are all relatively easy and/or productive for the beginner, although I would add cut-and-come-again salad leaves to the list if you like that sort of thing.

Read the "Richy's paper pots" sticky in this forum for a cheap and easy way to start growing plants from seed, and yes, hardening them off outside and planting the tender ones out after the risk of frost has passed is also important.

Keep hoeing away at the weeds for as long as you can before sowing outside and then  do so in marked straight drills to help you identify the wheat from the chaff (so to speak!)

I'm sure others will be along with more advice soon; Good Luck!

[lucywil]

at lot of people manage without a greenhouse/conservatory  by doing exactly what you are suggesting.

the main thing is to remember that it is all an experiment, finding out what works for you and what doesn't, what works one year might not work another so its always trial and error there are no hard and fast rules, not alot of help i know, sorry!!

[crh75]

I think you are worrying too much about this, most of the veg you mention will grow very nicely from seed straight in the ground.  Grow in straight lines between two sticks so you can tell the difference between seedling and weed.  Five minutes hoeing every couple of days and you will stay pretty weed free.

I would say that you may not have quite enough space to grow enough sweet corn to be worthwhile.  But that is up to you.

Basically stop worrying and enjoy and get the kids to do as much as possible you'll probably find that they eat much more veg if they have watched it grow!

[Salmo]

 I will concentrate on Runner beans/beetroot/early potatoes/Leeks/parsnips/Courgettes/sweetcorn/Shallots

Of these:
shallots in late Feb/early March
early potatoes, parsnips in March
beetroot, leeks in April
runner beans, courgettes, sweetcorn in pots late April /early May for planting out after frost.

[mumofstig]

When you need to know whether to start off indoor/poly greenhouse....my advice would  always be....read the seed packet 
Some things like a little warmth to germinate others are positively spoilt that way!

A good idea is to keep the pkts even after you've sown all of them, in case you need to refer back to them later. Throw them at the end of the year, making a note of any varieties you want to grow again (or not )

Good luck

[Brambles]

I agree with crh75...  You should stop stressing too much about it all...  I would get a few plants from garden centres...  Maybe some from car boots and those that don't like to be moved put seeds straight into the ground....   Beans are easy peasy to grow so do those yourself straight into the ground.  Also I agree to leave out sweet corn at least for a year or two.   Courgettes are easy from seed (sow indoors) but they do take up a lot of room as they run along the soil, (I let mine grow along edge of path).  Beets don't like to be moved so put seed direct in ground in rows.   Ask questions as you go and ENJOY

[Paul Plots]

When I sow a long row of seeds I tie a length of thin, coloured string between the two markers directly above the row. Sounds mad, maybe, but this way I know exactly what and where to hoe. I end up with some very easily weedable rows of seedlings with no weeds either side.  Those that do come up in the seed row are easy to pull by hand.

I learnt this from over enthusiastic hoe work in my first year when I hoed through the seedlings I'd sooner have kept mistaking them for weeds as the two had grown up together.   

[skewball]

Many many thanks for all your replies. I am probably looking into it too much.

I think for year 1 I should take it easy and plant as much as I can direct into the soil.

Interesting to see what people have said about sweetcorn. Is it quite hard to grow and/or take up a lot of room? I don’t have a huge amount of space but would have been interesting to see how I got on with it. I would probably not want to devote much more than a square metre for each vegetable to start with. (probably 1m by 1.5m per veg based on how I will prob do the beds). Would the yield be worth it for sweetcorn (i.e. 4 or 5 meals for a family of 4)

Many thanks again, I think I might like it round here! (one day I might even be able to contribute!!!)

[tode]

Hi Skewball,
I think the most important thing is to grow what you want, not what you feel you 'should'.  If you want to try a patch of corn, do it !   

Ours were great this year: we packed em in at about 20 cm apart, so a block of 1 sq meter should give you a few meals.

Good eating !     

[Salmo]

Of the crops on your list cougettes, sweet corn and potatoes take up a lot of room. Of these early potatoes are probably the most worthwhile. However, with all of these you can double crop. Early potatoes harvested in June can be followed by courgettes or sweetcorn if these are sown in pots and waiting to be planted out. Other crops that can follow early potatoes are leeks, brassicas, beetroot, dwarf beans.

Alternatively there is time grow salad crops before you plant out runner beans/sweet corn/cougettes.

[crh75]

The main reason I suggested to think about sweet corn is that you need a few of them in a group as they are wind pollinated.  If memory serves they should be spaced at least 30cm apart and up to 60cm apart to get large.  This means you need a fair amount of room to get a few sweet corns.  Also bare in mind each plant will only produce two corns (often one, three if you are really lucky!).  Courgettes and climbing beans, on the other hand, produce an abundance of crop in a relatively small amount of space. 

I would also consider some cherry tomatoes and cucumbers work very well trained up a cane.

[gillie]

I agree with nearly everything that has been said, but here are a few other things you might consider:

1.  Buy or make yourself some kind of cold frame or cloche to cover your early seedlings.  Sowing in late April/May is just fine, you will get better germination and the plants will soon catch up with ones sown earlier.  Even parsnips can do well sown as late as June.  Sow thinly - not necessarily the whole packet - but be prepared to re-sow anything that does not come up.  

My method of sowing direct in less that perfect soil:
Scrape out a drill rather larger than the seed packet suggests, line it with potting compost and firm it down, sow your seeds into the potting compost, cover with more  compost, firm again and then replace at least some of the soil on top.  Essentially you have made an in situ seed tray.  When the seedlings are strong enough the roots will push through into the soil.

2.  Reconsider the gravel paths.  Weeds will grow through them unless you put one of those weed suppressant membranes under the gravel.  However you are bound to drop soil onto the paths and will end up with a weedy quagmire.  Try to get hold of some paving slabs - possibly second hand.

3.  Be wary of buying from car boot sales.  You may import a disease along with your plants.  This is particularly important with onion types and brassicas.

4.  Be aware that garden centres are only too happy to sell you plants at the wrong time of year - usually way too early -  or stuff grown in modules which would be far better sown direct.  Don't assume that they 'know best'.  What they know best is how to sell, not how to grow.

Cheers,

Gillie