Lice help please!

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Lice help please!
« on: March 23, 2011, 14:38 »
Been doing a clean out and chuck check and found lice and white eggs around the vents of some of mine - yuk!

Everyone has been thoroughly dusted with a diatomaceous earth poultry treatment which is all my local shop has on offer.  I've just checked and can still see movement.  As it dehydrates is it going to take time to work and am I better getting a spray on line ?

Thanks for any help  :)

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PaulineM

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2011, 17:21 »
Hi
Get some frontline (kitten strength) and put a few drops on each chicken on their necks, the lice will be gone the next day.  :)
1 Hubby, 2 children, 2 Welsummers, 1 Leghorn Banty, 1 Wyandotte Banty, 1 Barnevelder, 2 Isa Brown, 1 Rhode Island, 1 Goldline,1 Maran, 2 Mottled Leghorns, 1 Leghorn cockerel & 2 Jack Russells

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feelingbroody

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2011, 18:12 »
It is one drop for small birds up to three for larger hybrids, there is a useful sticky on here with doseage, I give my hybrids 0.1ml from a small syringe on the back of their necks.

if wishes were changes.......

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2011, 19:20 »
Thanks - I have read Auntie's sticky.  I have tracked down more info and the stuff I have used will dehydrate and kill lice, but it needs to be applied evenly all over to be really effective.  Anyone's birds let them do this  :blink:

I have red mite powder and use that regularly but obviously these flippin' lice have evaded death so far.  I'm still itching after finding them  :tongue2:

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wildy78

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2011, 19:21 »
Frontline definately, i had the same the other day (heavy infestation) 1 spray (i find the spray better just one pump) and they were all gone, it seems to stay on the skin and takes care of the new hatchlings of lice too.  I was given the cat/dog strength by the vets who also reccommended that i buy it online next time as its nearly half the price of what a vet usually charges.  No egg withdrawal either.

good luck
1 wife, 1 daughter, 2 dogs, 1 horse, 1 Copper black maran, 1 Cherry Maran, 1 Speckled, 1 Sussex, 1 welsummer, 1 dorking, 1 silver laced wyandotte
6 new arrivals - 3 welsummers 3 barnvelder.
5 more new arrivals (pullets) - white star, fenton blue, fenton rose, plymouth rock, silver sussex

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hillfooter

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2011, 19:36 »
Thanks - I have read Auntie's sticky.  I have tracked down more info and the stuff I have used will dehydrate and kill lice, but it needs to be applied evenly all over to be really effective.  Anyone's birds let them do this  :blink:

I have red mite powder and use that regularly but obviously these flippin' lice have evaded death so far.  I'm still itching after finding them  :tongue2:

DE isn't a great solution for lice or for dusting on birds generally.  It's OK to use on the house for detering red mite colonies.  The Barrier Red Mite Powder (or their Louse Powder which is basically the same thing with the addition of avodado oil for glossing horses coats ) isn't much use as it's active ingredient is basically a mosquito repellent so it's of dubious value for lice or RM and pretty expensive talc (actually its sterilised corn flour based).  Insecticides like Frontline as note above which works externally or ivomectin which works externally and internally are effective but expensive.

It's not unusual for chx and birds generally to carry lice so there's no need to panic if it's a light infestation.

All the best.  Let us know how you get on.
HF
Truth through science.

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2011, 21:11 »
Thanks HF

I have had red mite once and killed them off with Poultry Shield.  I've used the powder since in the house bedding as a deterrant and dusted the birds monthly and not seen them since.  Maybe I've just been lucky  :unsure:  Was going to buy Battles Louse Powder, but after reading your post I'll forget that if it is the same thing  ;)

Looks like I'm going to have to go the insecticide route as there are too many of them for me to be comfortable with  :)


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hillfooter

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2011, 23:07 »
I don't know anything about Battles Louse powder however these days with all the regulations and testing requirements many of the old effective treatments have disappeared from the shelves as the manufacturers can't afford the enormous costs of getting the accreditation they now need.  For example if you are a gardener you will know Derris dust is no longer available and also a lot of the old formulations for things like Jeyes Fluid have been replaced with less effective safe modern ones.  So the only things you can get over the counter are a lot of ineffective repellant type products like Barrier's which don't need expensive testing or professional use products which aren't available to amateurs.

For deinfesting houses and particularly good for red mite is Ficam W or Milbenex which the suppliers are very reluctant to let amateurs have.  Apart from the Frontline and Ivermectin I don't know what else is effective.

HF

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feelingbroody

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2011, 11:42 »
HF

Do you use the frontline spray in the house as well, sorry I am confused now, I seem to have been unlucky with red mite surviving the winter itch itch itch  :nowink: :nowink:

The birds have been done with the frontline spot on as mentioned before I buy a dog phial and decant it to measure with a syringe ( as advised by a vet) this is the cheapest option, but with the house I change bedding regularly use red mite spray, powder and the birds seem clear.... so any suggestions

Thanks as always

Broody :) :)

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Casey76

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2011, 11:55 »
Red mite live in the house, and only visit the chicken to feed, so you are unlikely to find red mites on the bird.

Thankfully this is something I've yet to encounter, but you should wash the house thoroughy, paying particular attention to the ends of the roosts and any nooks and crannies (e.g. in the joins/overlaps of tongue and groove) etc

*scratch, scratch*

People use various methods to kill red mite, though regular washing with poultry sheild *scratch* works *scratch*

On another board they recommend dusting with ant powder containing permethrin,  and have great success combatting RM

*scratch, scratch, scratch*

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joyfull

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2011, 11:58 »
Use poultry shield in the coop, then use Diatom made into a slurry. If you are still struggling then I believe HF uses Ficam W to get rid of redmite - i on the other hand am getting rid of my wooden coops and getting plastic ones which don't harbour redmite and can be jet washed to remove them (however really this needs to be done well away from the ground the coops stay on as they will simply just crawl back up into the coop  >:().
Staffies are softer than you think.

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hillfooter

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2011, 12:55 »
HF

Do you use the frontline spray in the house as well, sorry I am confused now, I seem to have been unlucky with red mite surviving the winter itch itch itch  :nowink: :nowink:

The birds have been done with the frontline spot on as mentioned before I buy a dog phial and decant it to measure with a syringe ( as advised by a vet) this is the cheapest option, but with the house I change bedding regularly use red mite spray, powder and the birds seem clear.... so any suggestions

Thanks as always

Broody :) :)

Sorry to confuse you but as advised above Frontline and ivomectin are for use on birds and kill lice, fleas and feather mites which live on the birds but RM colonise the house and only visit the chx at night for a couple of hours to feed.  Although Frontline and Ivomecytin will kill them it only gets them a the feeding stage of their life cycle and will therefore take a long time to get rid of them.  Using an insecticide like Ficam W or Milbenex which have a residual effect (long lasting) will keep you house clear for a year or more.  

Poultry Shield is basically a detergent and all detergents have a disinfecting action and will kill bacteria and parasites which have a waxy coating like RM but they only work on CONTACT WHEN WET.  Once they dry a new infestation can occur and they aren't very effective if at all on RM eggs so several applications are needed to zapp the adult and larva stages of their lifecycle so no further RM eggs get laid.  One application won't get the dormant eggs.  Cheap washing up liquid is also effect and probably as effective as PS at much reduced cost.  

DE (diatomaceous earth) works by creating a dry and abrasive environment which RM can't live in so it's works in the house by harborage denial.  It's as much use as dustbathing if dusted on the birds but there are concerns over it's safety dusted on so I only use it painted on perches and in corners and cracks where they colonise.  Mix into a slurry made with Vanadine V18 disinfectant liquid which remains active even when exposed to organic dirt which neutralises caustic disinfectants.  So painted on in a disinfectant base kills two birds with one stone so to speak.

Wooden houses when new don't harbour RM as the preservative used on the wood contains insecticides and anti-fungicides.  These in the good old days before the EU regulations used to contain a weeak arsenic compound which remained active for upto 5+years or so and many new keepers never saw RM for this reason.  These days because of the modern regulations which demand you use less active ingredients this effect is much reduced and the insecticides disipate quickly.  Similarly with the old creosote which is now banned.

Plastic houses don't tend to harbour RM because they don't hold the moisture and humid conditions RM need though they still can colonise in seams.  Plastic houses (where the plastic is hard and a smooth surface finish) is easy to clean and dosen't encourage RM.  Plastic per se isn't a cure for RM it's the conditions it produces which deter RM.  If you use plastic which has a rough surface which holds dirt and has scratches in it might almost be as bad as wood for RM.  I'd be cautious about assuming recycled plastic will performas well as say and EGLU.

Mineral felt on roofs are classic places for red mite to colonise as they provide the ideal conditions for them to breed and once establish there they are unshiftable without striping the roof.  Usually the problem doesn't show for a few years and until the preservative leaches out.  I occassionally see posts from people who say they've never had RM in their felt roofs when they've only had them a couple of years but give it time.

HF

Best wishes

HF
« Last Edit: March 24, 2011, 18:41 by hillfooter »

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feelingbroody

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2011, 17:22 »
HF and Casey thank you for your reply it must have taken ages !!! I do appreciate it, if you were to advise purchasing one item therefore to eradicate the blighters what would it be??? I will go and get it post haste!!

I am fed up of using poultry shield, red mite spray smite, jeyes, the list goes on, I can assure you I am trying and the fact they survived in the winter confuses me even more.

However if you would be good enough to suggest a killer and where I might get it from I and the ladies would be most grateful!!

And..... the blighters do bite humans too, I have had one in my hair yuk and it did bite  :wacko: :wacko:

So maybe I need a good old splash with the killer stuff too.

~Thank you again and sorry for taking up your time with such a itchy subject   ;) ;)

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hillfooter

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2011, 17:49 »
HF and Casey thank you for your reply it must have taken ages !!! I do appreciate it, if you were to advise purchasing one item therefore to eradicate the blighters what would it be??? I will go and get it post haste!!

I am fed up of using poultry shield, red mite spray smite, jeyes, the list goes on, I can assure you I am trying and the fact they survived in the winter confuses me even more.

However if you would be good enough to suggest a killer and where I might get it from I and the ladies would be most grateful!!

And..... the blighters do bite humans too, I have had one in my hair yuk and it did bite  :wacko: :wacko:

So maybe I need a good old splash with the killer stuff too.

~Thank you again and sorry for taking up your time with such a itchy subject   ;) ;)

I'd recommend you talk to Bowden & Knights www.bowdenandknights.com speak with one of the partners and see what he can offer you.  Explain that you want something which will give a longterm residual protection against RM.  They now have an online shop which sells insecticide over the web I believe.
HF

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Re: Lice help please!
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2011, 15:29 »
Well the chucks had a FL treatment today.  The dusting I gave them had reduced the lice but not cleared them.  I've had a really good scrape round the housing and no sign of the dreaded red mite, so hopefully that will sort all pest problems as they were wormed recently so covered all the bases. 

When mine had red mite they were reluctant to go to bed and not seen that behaviour since but am going to switch to HF's house mite deterrant painting technique rather than use the red mite powder I have used in the past.

HF - if you read this, do you dust your birds at all or just treat them with insecticide as needed.  Think I am going to struggle to get Ivermectin but FL is obtainable  :)



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