Allotment Gardening Advice Help Chat
Poultry and Pets => The Hen House => Topic started by: Tigerwren on February 22, 2011, 12:14
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Hi
I have gone today to have a chat with my girls and noticed that my cream legbar's ears are red, not white like they were before. She is only about 18/19 wks and I saw her parents when I picked her up. She does have a lighter colouring than her sisters were - she is more of a salmon colour. Does this mean that she is not a cream legbar? (she has a beautifull crest etc and otherwise looks 'right') Or is there a problem? Any ideas or suggestions very welcome! :)
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Cream legbars should have a grey body with pink/salmon coloured breast
http://www.cream-legbar.co.uk/
:D
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Hi Casey,
thanks, yes i have been on lots of websites but not seen anything exactly like her. Her siblings were the typical cream legbar and she did look like them in all other ways, although her feathers were lighter. It doesn't really matter other than the fact that I would like to know if I've been had. She is adorable in temperament, loves a cuddle (when you catch her) so I wouldn't get rid or exchange her. I just wondered. Thanks for your link. :)
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my cream legbar has red ear lobes and lays a blue egg
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Hi Chickadee,
Hoping that my girl is going to be like yours then and she doesn't have a problem :D Is your legbar quite grey? ???
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It sounds as if you may have a Columbine, which is a Legbar hybrid. Have a look at this link -
http://www.glencroftpoultry.co.uk/COLUMBINE2.JPG
They tend to be more Salmon in colour and lay a blue/olive egg.
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Hi all,
Have finally managed to get my OH to help me upload a pic. I thought you might enjoy telling me what options I have as I now think maybe a Cotswold legbar??? ::)
I also noticed that her ears change colour depending on how stretched her neck is and there is a blue ish tinge although still a bit red.
Thanks for any help for Ethel's parentage
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Hi Helenaj,
just seen your message (it took me aaaaages to reduce the size of the file size!!). Yes, she does look very like the Columbine in the picture from your link. Thanks for taking the time to post. What do you think? Would you say Columbine? :)
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I'm off to buy a 19 week columbine tomorrow! She looks very much like their picture on the website.
http://www.chickens-for-sale.com/Point%20of%20Lay%20Hens.html
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Well Cammi, if she's anything like mine, you will have an amazing girl! I love mine to bits!! :D :D
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She's not like my Cotswold Legbar :)
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Thanks Sassy, I can probably rule that out then! ;)
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your lady, looks just like my two Columbine...They are Awesome Birds, VERY good layers, and quite friendly to, Not flighty at all ( well mine arnt) :D
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Hi all,
Have finally managed to get my OH to help me upload a pic. I thought you might enjoy telling me what options I have as I now think maybe a Cotswold legbar??? ::)
I also noticed that her ears change colour depending on how stretched her neck is and there is a blue ish tinge although still a bit red.
Thanks for any help for Ethel's parentage
Well if you haven't figured this out yet she's not a Cream Legbar but unless you particularly wanted a CLB or paid a premium for one it probably doesn't matter.
I remember when I bought my first CLB hen she was quite expensive as I bought her from a specialist breeder who was working on an improvement programme. Unfortunately my cock wasn't so good (now sadly departed) but their offspring are nice hens which lay reasonable blue eggs and apart from having an over large tail are good examples of CLBs. A Columbine is a Hybrid hen bred from selected strains of Cream Legbar and Arucana. They are being developed as a commercial bluse egg layer and not so far as I know currently suficiently standardised so I guess almost certainly the hens you saw were progeny from a breeding programme which will have varying characteristics. Was the supplier developing Columbines or was he just taking stock from a breeding programme.
It's very regretable that amateur breeders are jumping on the backyard poultry bandwaggon and producing birds which look like the pure breeds that have been used in their make up and are described as such but have a mixed genetic and non standardised genetic make up. Offspring from such chickens will have alsorts of characteristics and looks which end up poluting the pure breed strain if propagated. If these birds were sold to you as CLB that's either through ignorance or fraud. Very often though breeders carelessly describe the birds as the the familiar pure breed or a cross of a purebreed and that is what sticks in the novice purchasers mind. I've had people tell me my pure breed birds are over priced Sussex when infact they are comparing them with prices of hybrids described as Sussex. There was a recent post on this site which referenced a seller on ebay who was selling buff X light sussex crosses as a Buff Sussex. This maybe OK if they aren't bred from and described correctly as first crosses but it's a practise open to abuse.
I see many posts on this site which talk about hybrids as "breeds" and compare characteristics whereas in fact the birds are from different breeders and have widely varied individual characteristics though described similarly or often indentically.
HF
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Tigerwren, I would definately say that you have a Columbine - she looks exactly the same as mine. I have three Columbines. All three have a slightly differing colour to each other, but all are mainly the salmon colour - and yours is a mirror image of one of mine. They are lovely birds, but can be a bit of a bully to newcomers. The egg colour also varies, I have a blue, olive green and a tinted egg layer which makes the daily egg collection a very colourful sight! I would echo Hillfooter's comments though. If you paid for her as a legbar then you need to go back to your supplier and ask for a refund.
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Hi Hillfooter and Helenaj,
When I contacted the breeder it was because I specifically wanted a Cream legbar and I asked him specifically if he had them to which he said yes. I then went and purchased her and a white star on the basis that she was a cream legbar. I feel like a bit of an idiot actually because I knew that she was a bit different to the others, but thought that was cute. I know that the eggs are all the same when you open them, but wanted a blue egg layer specifically and because of that I did pay more than I would have for a normal hybrid. I don't want to give her away because as I said previously, she really is a lovely bird, but at the same time, I don't know if I have any basis for argument. With thoroughbred dog and horses etc you get 'proof' don't you that they are well bred, but with a chicken you kind of take people on their word. Can I ring the people up and complain? or are they going to laugh at my ignorance (as I have myself!). I am new to the world of chickens and only started with my first girls at the start of Nov, but it is a lesson learnt. It is such as shame that it is hard to find reputable places for nice birds without being ripped off. (I got this place on the poultry supplier list on this site, but it does say that they haven't checked everyone out, so then my own fault?)
Thanks for the replies
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You are not the only one to be coned I bought eggs off ebay and paid a premium for what I thought would be good examples of buff orpingtons but they have turned out to be crosses, they have green tail feathers and are a rusty brown colour so I am not sure what they have been crossed with. I contacted the breeder and he asked if I was sure that they were his eggs!! I don't want to get rid of the birds as they are great but at the end of the day they are not what I paid for. >:(
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Bad times Trinamc, I think there should be somewhere where people can check reviews of these people and not made up ones on ebay! I think it must have been really frustrating for you to have incubated these eggs and then seen something hatch which you weren't expecting/hadn't paid for. Did you have any way of complaining or getting compensation? It's so out of order people doing this kind of thing. I feel very bad for you, have you any idea what they might have been crossed with? Probably could have been anything I suppose. Were you hoping to sell them or were they for pets? :(
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While the majority of people on ebay no doubt are honest enthusiasts the temptation for unscrupulous people to make lots of money is a very tempting proposition. Last year chocolate orps eggs were going for up to £200 per half dozen on ebay. When there's no guarentee what the hatch rate will be it must be a very tempting proposition to just put in a couple of fertile eggs along with say 4 from the supermarket and triple your money who's to know, the post service will get the blame. The daftest thing to do is actually supply fertile but wrong pedegree eggs as you are bound to be found out. I stopped getting eggs from ebay when I had some rather dubious Speckled Sussex and also some which I suspected as carrying an infection. I'd had some good batches up until then but now I don't buy anything I haven't seen and the setup they were breed in and preferably talked to the breeder not the young girls who helps out on a Saturday.
Usually if a breeder has hybrid stock I'd be very dubious if he also had pure breeds too. I'm not saying he couldn't have but often retail "breeders" are really just growers who are supplied with fertile eggs or even young growers from the real breeder so they may not even know the true breeding make up.
HF
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Tigerwren - don't feel bad, we've all been caught out when "purebreeds" turn out not to be pure, it's part and parcel of the learning curve albeit an expensive one. I ended up with two Light Sussex that are now buff, but I wouldn't get rid of them just for being the wrong colour. Needless to say, I've not gone back to that particular breeder. I'm not saying you should take her back, if you are like me and most of the other members on this forum, we love our hens for who they are rather than their breeding and to be honest, I've found the Columbines to be much more affectionate than my Legbars and complete nutcases! She may still lay a blue egg, you'll just have to wait and see.
It just really annoys me when people you rely on to be honest (i.e. the breeder) take advantage of you because they know you are inexperienced. At least you'll be a bit more wary in future.
As for Ebay eggs, I've had good and bad experiences. I've bought eggs that have turned out to be completely infertile and I've also had eggs sent over from Ireland in a polybox that looked as though someone had played football with it and all six eggs hatched into perfect Exchequer Leghorns. Like all things purchased unseen, it's a risk. Don't let this experience put you off. Thankfully, the bulk of breeders are honest and helpful.
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Hi Hillfooter and Helenaj,
When I contacted the breeder it was because I specifically wanted a Cream legbar and I asked him specifically if he had them to which he said yes. I then went and purchased her and a white star on the basis that she was a cream legbar. I feel like a bit of an idiot actually because I knew that she was a bit different to the others, but thought that was cute. I know that the eggs are all the same when you open them, but wanted a blue egg layer specifically and because of that I did pay more than I would have for a normal hybrid. I don't want to give her away because as I said previously, she really is a lovely bird, but at the same time, I don't know if I have any basis for argument. With thoroughbred dog and horses etc you get 'proof' don't you that they are well bred, but with a chicken you kind of take people on their word. Can I ring the people up and complain? or are they going to laugh at my ignorance (as I have myself!). I am new to the world of chickens and only started with my first girls at the start of Nov, but it is a lesson learnt. It is such as shame that it is hard to find reputable places for nice birds without being ripped off. (I got this place on the poultry supplier list on this site, but it does say that they haven't checked everyone out, so then my own fault?)
Thanks for the replies
At the end of the day there is the 'buyer beware' argument but if you specified a cream legbar than that is what you should have got, the law would back you on this but proving it would be very difficult. Trading Standards could give him the gypsies warning though. Could you really return your hen though?
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Hi Sassy,
I could definitely not part with her now! She is my favourite and comes in every evening for a cuddle. At the end of the day, it's only an egg and even is she never laid one in her life it wouldn't make any difference to how I feel about her. I am going to give the man a ring and see what he says just for the sake of telling him, I know what he's done.
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Tigerwren
It is very frustrating to hatch eggs and wait until they have feathers to find out they are not what you expected, I bought the eggs to be able to use them to breed with the hens I already had. I contacted the person I had them from and he has now replaced the 3 eggs that hatched so at least that is something. It was a batch of 12 eggs of which 6 were no good, 1 died soon after hatching and only 2 were buffs so I don't think the eggs were very good in the first place.
Like you say I wouldn't get rid of the ones I have raised but it makes me think twice about where you get eggs from in the future. :)
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I too have a suspect cream leg bar, but such a fantastic little bird, I wouldn't swap her for the world.
She's lighter than her siblings, and though I was told I could choose the one I wanted, she was the only one left when I got there.
How far off is she?
Just waiting to see what colour eggs she'll lay :)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/OpiumEater/0a3ee2ad.jpg)
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I too have a suspect cream leg bar, but such a fantastic little bird, I wouldn't swap her for the world.
She's lighter than her siblings, and though I was told I could choose the one I wanted, she was the only one left when I got there.
How far off is she?
Just waiting to see what colour eggs she'll lay :)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/OpiumEater/0a3ee2ad.jpg)
Difficult to see all the points on this photo. Best to show a side shot not looking down, but this link has the Poultry Club standard in it if you scroll down to it.
http://www.harislau.co.uk/autosexing-legbar.htm
I can see from the leg colour which looks to be white and should be yellow it's not a great example. Unless you want to show or breed it probably shouldn't matter to you.
Here's one of mine which I'm not claiming as a great example either. The legs are more yellow than they appear on this shot. This was in fact one which was rejected for breeding from by a show breeder as it was thought too small though actually I think it's OK.
(http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m491/hillfooter/CreamLegbar5yo.jpg)
HF
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Hi HF, I was hoping to catch your attention :)
The sibling was a deeper colour more like yours. When I rang I was told they were Cream Legbars and a blue egg laying strain. When I got there, this was her and when I was shown the eggs, they were either blue or olive (at a stretch). I assume the colour was so faint due to being so near the end of their laying season, but was disappointed there is a chance she may not lay blue as this is prodomantly what I wanted.
The trouble was after waiting so long to find one fairly locally and then for her to mature, I didn't have the heart to say no. At least she didnt charge me the £35 for a point of lay bird.
But on the plus side, she is a fantastic little bird, obviously well cared for and used to handling.
I never wanted one for breeding, but the link for the standards is really usefull, thank you.
Will put a better picture up anyway, than can have fun picking out her flaws :)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/OpiumEater/61e1c4b5.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/OpiumEater/bfb245ec.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/OpiumEater/db139d8f.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb328/OpiumEater/be10ffd7.jpg)
Actually getting a photo when her face isn't stuck into the ground is quite a feat :)
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cream legbars blue egg laying genes come from the araucana. The egg colour of a pure araucana can also vary considerably from pale blue (almost white) through to olive green so no guarantees with these unless you know the strain of both the male and the female lines.
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Thanks Joyful, I'll just have to wait and see :unsure:, but I can't imagine getting eggs until next year! She was meant to be 16 weeks when I picked her up, which would make her 20 weeks now, but still looks very small. And now the nights are drawing in, any hope of eggs are out of the window ::)
By the way HF, her legs are a very mellow yellow and I think she's actually doing quite good on the points from the link you give me :D But maybe I'm looking through the eyes of someone who gets too attached to their hens.
And yours is a beaut! Love the top knot.
Christine
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Her colouring is actually quite good, though her legs could be a little yellower.
She looks much younger than 20 weeks though, sorry! I'd estimate about she is as young as 14-15 weeks right now, given her build, feathering and comb size/colour :)
You might find this interesting... http://www.cream-legbar.co.uk/history.html
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I'd agree with Casey she does look too far wrong and may well turn out to be fine. I'd say she looked immature too. Crest and tail feathering will improve I suspect. It's very difficult wuith some breeds to tell a pre breed from a cross from a photo. When she lays that will tell you something. Although they can lay olive green eggs as Joy says, depends if this is a strain which has been bred for blue egg production. They have Aruncana which gives the egg shell colour and Leghorn which are prolific white egg layer. The Leghorn characteristics tend to make them a little flighty and nervous as well as improve their laying.
I hatched around a dozen from my hen though I wasn't able to get a good breeding cockerel unfortunately. He looks a bit scruffy in this photo as he was just starting to moult. However the offspring were vere pretty and good layers though one produced cream/ivory coloured eggs. Their tails were rather full and held rather erect too.
(http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m491/hillfooter/Chicken%20Chat%20posts/CreamLegbarWEB.jpg)
(http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m491/hillfooter/Chicken%20Chat%20posts/CreamLegbarRoosterWEB.jpg)
Best wishes
HF