Removing weed membrane

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suedenim

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Removing weed membrane
« on: November 04, 2012, 11:26 »
Hi Everyone

I have just taken over a half plot which was not maintained for at least 12 months. The previous owner evidently ran out of steam and enthusiasm. Roughly half the plot has been cultivated with 3 raised beds which wont take too much effort to get into shape. However I am stumped by what to do with the other half.

He seems to have just added a weed membrane to the ground, some of which is black plastic and some of which is the fabric type stuff. He seems to have added 3-4 inches of B&Q top soil (judging from the empty sacks in the corner.) However the weeds have grown through the membrane and the soil seems to be heavily compacted with the texture of plasticine and it is totally saturated.

What is the best way of solving the problem? Some parts just peel back like a very heavy carpet, but it' so compacted underneath. I think I need to try and take up the membrane and then dig it to open up the soil. Should I add sand to try and improve the texture, or should it be OK if I take the membrane up and let winter do the work?

It seems his 'short cut' to avoid digging has created more digging for me! To make things worse, I've now built a giant bonfire on the uncultivated half before I realised that there was plastic underneath the top soil. Will it be OK to light, or should I dismantle it, remove the plastic and then start again?

Any advice and encouragement would be appreciated

cheers

SUE

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Aunt Sally

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2012, 11:44 »
I don't  think there will be any short cut to this problem Sue  :(

First of all I think you need to identify what types of weed are present.  If they are nasty perennial weeds the would need to be dealt with first.  It's a bit late for weed killer but you can dig out things like bramble, docs, nettles.  Couch, mare's tail, bindweed and a few others are not easy to dig out.

The weeds can be removed from the surface with a strimmer (or brush cutter) when they have died down.  This might help with lifting the weed suppressant matting (which I think should always be lifted each year anyway).  If you don't have a big perennial weed problem you could hire a big rotavator to turn it over for the frost to work on.  If there are nasty weeds then you may need to hand dig it :( 

If you do decide that weed killer is needed then you may have to wait until early spring to do it dig it a couple of weeks later.

Others here will be able to give you advice about soil improvement but it sounds to me that it needs lots of organic material dug in (manure if you can get it) and as it's been covered and compacted it would probably benefit from liming.  A pH test kit would tell you about that.

Good luck :)

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Salmo

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2012, 13:37 »
Soil that has been under membrane always looks like plasticine. With all the rain lately it will look even more so. Lets hope that you are pleasantly surprised when it dries out.

I would remove the membrane. At least then you will see what you have got. If you can move the bonfire all well and good, if not then burn it. The plastic underneath will melt but you can clean that up. No more weeds will grow between now and the Spring.

Unti you can see what the soil is like I would not add anything.

Digging or rotovating the soil when it is very wet will mess it up. You may need to wait until it starts to dry out in the Spring. Do not be in a hurry to plant. Better to get the soil into good condition first.

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JamethielD

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2012, 18:07 »
Totally agree that soil under membrane and plastic looks odd - let the weather and winter at it and see how it is in the spring.

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suedenim

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2012, 20:47 »
Thanks for all the replies

The area is covered/smothered with creeping buttercups and small amount of dock, so no chance of rotivating it. I suspect he put the membrane down to smother them and then decided to plant over the membrane, but never got round to doing it, so not only have I got to remove the the surface buttercups, I've still got the roots to get out underneath. *sigh*

I can't really complain though, he's left x2 dalek compost bins, a shed with tools, a water butt, cold-frame and a picnic bench. I've saved myself a fortune on infrastructure, so the only cost I will incur is time and effort.

A condition of the lease is that 75% is ready for cultivation by March. I've already cleared and planted onions and garlic in one of the beds and plan to clear the rest this month. That's roughly 50% done, so I should be able to get it up to standard by March.  :blink:



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Salmo

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2012, 23:54 »
Creeping buttercup and docks are both controlled well with glyphosate (e.g. Roundup). As long as there are green leaves it still works in the Winter, it just takes a little longer. You will need a dry day and dry leaves, which is a hard to find at this time of year.

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Sideshoot

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2012, 07:05 »
A condition of the lease is that 75% is ready for cultivation by March. I've already cleared and planted onions and garlic in one of the beds and plan to clear the rest this month. That's roughly 50% done, so I should be able to get it up to standard by March.  :blink:

wow and i thought our comittee were little hitlers.
75% ready seems alot to achieve bearing in mind the workload you have on it.

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Aunt Sally

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2012, 09:32 »
wow and i thought our comittee were little hitlers.
75% ready seems alot to achieve bearing in mind the workload you have on it.

I'm sure all of us committee members are, Sideshoot  ::)

75% is a very big ask for the first year when you have such a difficult task to do on the plot.  Speak to the committee and negotiate a level of cultivation that would show good effort without being unreasonable for you to accomplish.

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suedenim

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Re: Removing weed membrane
« Reply #8 on: November 05, 2012, 20:45 »
Luckily I do know one of the Committee  ::) and he helped me get this plot, as I volunteer on a community plot but wanted to get one of my own. The actual wording is 'ready to cultivate.' Last year a number of plots were let, but subsequently abandoned and the common theme was that nothing was done with them over winter, so the committee want new tenants to get cracking before they get too behind, especially if we have another growing season of bad weather.

The committee are on the whole reasonable if you talk to them, so I don't anticipate too many problems. It's better to have a committee who demand a high standard in my opinion as not only does it maintain standards, it creates a common bond between the plot holders. We love a good grumble about the passive aggressive emails which follow the bi-monthly inspections...



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