Allotment Gardening Advice Help Chat
Poultry and Pets => The Hen House => Topic started by: katey on January 25, 2011, 08:50
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Hi,
I collected my first ever hens 3 days ago,2 silkies and a pilkie.They're all 18 months old and were free to a good home as their previous owner had developed a bad allergy.
The 2 silkies are fine but the pilkie had duck poo stuck to her foot when i collected her.
Their owner tried to get it off but said it was pulling at her scales a bit.she said it would probably work it's way off or come off during her moult.
When i got them home i left them alone for a few hours to settle in but then noticed that the pilkie seemed to be in pain and was limping.
Yesterday i tried soaking her foot in warm water for 20 mins but it's stuck like concrete.It did look like it had pulled at her leg.....there was a bit of pinky non scaly bit.She hasn't wanted to leave the nest box from the start and i have to lift her out for food/ water.
I have purple spray.......would that help.....?
I will try to contact her previous owner tonight but in the meantime is there anything i can do for her.Should i be taking her to the vet?
Sorry for the long post but i'm getting really worried now.
I'd be so grateful if any of you could advise me.
Kate
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are you sure it is duck pooh. Most chicks clean up with a bit of soap and water so if they have not i am thinking it could be something else.
Try using vaseline on the leg and see if it is actually pooh or a scab.
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Thanks i'll try it.Could be a scab but it's enormous.The water looked a bit grainy when i bathed it yesterday....i just don't know.
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Look at these (http://www.google.ch/imgres?imgurl=http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y286/helena_the_chicken_lady/Coops/dsc01041.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php%3Fid%3D211367&usg=__G50ZDYkS9Pj21Wo0ldZVAeejuVE=&h=480&w=640&sz=47&hl=en&start=34&zoom=1&tbnid=E2aWucpIaB8miM:&tbnh=103&tbnw=137&ei=w5I-TbvSFZOFhQfXs_idCg&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbumblefoot%2Bchickens%26start%3D20%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26gbv%3D2%26tbs%3Disch:1&itbs=1) photos of bumble foot
Does it look similar to this?
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They do get scaly legs and if not treated properly will cause them pain and can cause limping.
Might be a good idea to find a chook friendly vet and get some antibiotics
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Hi
When I got my hens one had a ball like thing stuck on one toe, the owner said it was just hardened poo and that it would work its way off, after a few days there was no improvement. We ended up picking it with all sorts (whilst completely securing the toe so that there was no movement) it was a two person job, but eventually we removed it. It was just like concrete as you described and although it was picking up dew from the grass it had just got heavier rather than falling off.
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Hi again
Just wanted to add if you are sure its just muck of some sort you could try standing her in a bowl of warm water for 20 mins and see if that would soften it. :)
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One of my ex barn birds had a big round lump on one claw that was infact hardened mash food ( must admit it was funy when she CLUNKED over the shed floor !!!) I softened it in warm water then gentley cut it off bit by bit with small scissors. Once I got through the hard surface it came off very easy. She suffered no damage at all, although i ned to cut back her claw.
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Do you have a photo you could post? Last year, I rescued a couple of Marans that belonged to a neighbour who simply could not look after them. One had a leg ring and her Scaly Leg infection was so bad it had completely covered the ring. It looked like a huge lump of grey poo. It was only through several warm water soakings and lots of careful picking did we manage to remove the buildup of scaly matter and eventually the ring.
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Hi,thanks so much for the replies!
Had a power cut 9-4 that my dear OH forgot to tell me about .
Casey76....thanks for the link but it doesn't look like that,it's like a huge lump onthe top of her foot.
Bless her,she just keeps holding it up and it's a bit shaky.She's eating and drinking fine when kicked out of the nest box.
I'll try another soak and pick..(I've been a bit frightened of hurting her)and try and get some photo's up(need OH for that!).
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If it is any consolation chickens can cope with a fair bit of prodding and poking to their feet. We had Bumblefoot in quite a few of our chickens and ended up using a scalpel to remove the "bumble" and prod around in the hole to ensure all the pus was removed.
All I would say is if you do end up disturbing scales or removing the lump results in an open wound, ensure you dress it and keep it clean and dry.
If you have any doubts it may be worth visiting a poultry friendly vets (I know it's hardly the introduction to keeping chickens that you would want).
Good luck and I hope your chook is soon on the mend. :)
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You could try using a banana skin. ie the inside of the skin next to what you want to remove and use Vetwrap to bandage it on. This should help to soften and remove whatever it is. Salt water is always good to bathe a wound in just not too strong. Vets use salt water all the time. Good luck :)
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Sounds to me as though the lady couldn't cope. If they were cleaned and cared for in the first place I don't think this would have happened. Maybe that's why she rehomed them. Fell behind with the husbandry side of chook keeping. Try soaking with warm water and a little drop of olive oil.
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Hi Katey,
How is her foot today?
Pol
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Hi,unfortunately it's still no better.I've been soaking and picking.......tried the vaseline too!
OH has been promising to knock off work early to help me but that hasn't happened(not his fault....he's snowed under with call outs)
I can't see her like this any more and the other two are really picking on her and she's such a tiny thing too :( ,so i'm taking her to the vet.At least then i know she'll be looked after properly.
Thanks to everyone for all the advice and i'll post to say what vet says.
Fingers crossed it will be put right in a flash!
kate
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My fingers are crossed
Pol
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Back from vet.He thinks it's a build up from untreated scaly leg mite.He clipped off what he could until it started to bleed,gave her a shot of ab's and 3 doses of oral ab for me to give her here.i need to continue the salt water bathing and vaseline.
He said the other 2 hens will be infected now also, as it's very contagious.........great! >:(
Their last owner didn't house them together.
What a mess!I feel really down.
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Hi
You are probably just feeling a little overwhelmed at the moment. :(
Take it a step at a time.
Scaley leg isn't too hard to get rid of, mine had it too.
We caught our girls and gently massage vaseline all over the legs, (this smoothers the mites) for a week. Then we washed their legs with dog shampoo and gently scrubbed them. Next fill a jar with surgical spirit and dip each leg into this for 30 seconds, repeat this stage for 3 weeks. You will see a big difference even after the first week.
If your little girl is still getting bullied spray her with anti-peck spray and others won't like the taste and hopefully leave her alone. There are other ways to stop bullying but try this easy way first. :)
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I guess it could have been a lot worse. I had a hen I bought from somewhere once who also had the same problem, she was walking round with it fror at least 6 months before I realised it probably longer, but the others never did catch it, your onto it now which is a good thing. I've been keeping chickens now for years but I don't want to appear ignorant can someone tell me what a pilkie is anyway. It's obviously crossed with a silkie but what else. Is it a new breed of chook?
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Pekin x silkie :)
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Thankyou paulineM,
Is that vaseline once a day for a week then spirit once a day for 3 weeks?
She's inside now.....where she'll stay,until i get some peck spray.
You really are a fantastic bunch on here! :)
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Now you know what it is, she will be better in know time keep
Pol
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Hi
I massaged in the vaseline every other day for a week, not too thickly but enough to get under the scales, then I used the surgical spirit only, once a week for 3 weeks.
I'm not that experienced as I have only had my girls from August so some other more experienced keepers might be able to add to this advice as well.
I have the Hayes Chicken manual which gives all sorts of useful remedies for all sort of problems you can come across. :)
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Hi Katey
I have read somewhere that Frontline for cats / kittens will kill off Scaly Leg Mite. A couple of drops on the skin at the back of each chickens neck is all that's necessary. Its not licensed for treating chickens but a lot of people use it. It also sorts out other external parasites so I believe. The birds need treating 2 or 3 times a year to keep them parasite free.
Just be aware that your coop bedding may also be contaminated with lice / eggs so it would be worth having a good clean out.
If you decide to try Frontline search the site for additional information.
Good Luck
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I second PaulineM with regards to the Haynes Manual. It has some really good photos too which is really useful when you need to compare something you are dealing with. It may be worth investing in a copy, as it covers just about everything a new chicken keeper needs and might like to know.
Good luck with treating your girl, I'm sure you'll have her back on her feet in no time and then you can enjoy the fun part of keeping chickens :)
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Thanks Foghorn-Leghorn,I definately need to do some reading up.I'll look out for a copy.My word.....what a learning curve i'm on!!!! :ohmy:
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To Helenaj,
Thanks for the pm.I can't reply until i've had 10 posts apparently.Not sure what that means but anyway i've got it and thanks so much.You really set my mind at rest.Hope you read this.
Kate :)
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at the moment Katey you have made 10 posts so only 1 more then you can send pm's :D.
This rule was introduced to help prevent spamers from joining and sending out spam to all of us :)
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Hi
I am glad you took your chicken to the vet. At least now you know how to treat it.
I asked my vet about the frontline theory when I had a scaly leg problem and was told not to do it. She did give me drops to put on the neck (the chickens, not mine) so same theory, but not the same product :)
Good luck with your chicken and it seems to me that you are doing everything right. You have some very lucky chickens!
Linda
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Hi Katey,
You seem to be doing great so the scaley mite problem treatment should start to work. I'm surprised the vet didn't give you something better to treat the mite and although the vaseline will work it's a lot of work and something like Frontline (and I expect Ivermectin too) would be effective and a lot less effort as Fisherman said. See
http://www.chicken-house.co.uk/acatalog/Harkamectin__ivermectin_Drops.html
for ivermectin which i suspect will be much cheaper than Frontline.
A thorough clean out of your house is also advisable though scaley mite unlike red mite live on the birds not in the house. Some people smear vaseline (buy petroleum jelly from the baby section at super drugs for a cheaper brand than vaseline) on the roosts to prevent migration from bird to bird. Although it is likely to spread with time it is usually very slow to spread as the mites need to leave the infected bird an crawl to a new one so your other two may not be infected. If you treated in time they may well be OK
New scales are always slow to grow back and with bad damage some scaring may remain but I'm sure you will beat this fairly quickly and it's not that common once you rid them they should be fine.
HF
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Goodness HF, don't you ever go to bed! ;)
Katy, I'm pleased that everything is getting sorted out.
I would definitely treat the others for lice and mites too (either with Harkamectin or frontline spot-ons)
And, although it may be tempting as the scales are raised and rough, please don't try to pull them off, it will make your bird(s) very sore, and increase the likelyhood of secondary infections.
What you can do, is that if ther are still build-ups of encrustations (and these encrustations are the faeces of the leg mites) is to soak the legs in warm water, and with a soft tooth brush clean the legs in that manner. You can then apply vasiline to the legs once they have been cleaned and dried, but this is more to soften the scale a bit, rather than to smother the mites (which will have been killed by the spot-on treatment).
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Goodness HF, don't you ever go to bed! ;)
Katy, I'm pleased that everything is getting sorted out.
I would definitely treat the others for lice and mites too (either with Harkamectin or frontline spot-ons)
And, although it may be tempting as the scales are raised and rough, please don't try to pull them off, it will make your bird(s) very sore, and increase the likelyhood of secondary infections.
What you can do, is that if ther are still build-ups of encrustations (and these encrustations are the faeces of the leg mites) is to soak the legs in warm water, and with a soft tooth brush clean the legs in that manner. You can then apply vasiline to the legs once they have been cleaned and dried, but this is more to soften the scale a bit, rather than to smother the mites (which will have been killed by the spot-on treatment).
I don't sleep a lot!
I must say I was a little concerned that the vet caused bleeding removing the encrustation. The usual treatment is to sften the scales that are damaged with soapy water & petroleum jelly and gently scrub them off over time with a toothbrush, use the MILs brush though :D.
HF
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Thanks all,
I've been waiting for sally the pilkie's leg/foot to heal up before i go in with the spray.I'm planning to spray and de-louse the whole flock this weekend,along with a very thorough clean of the coop.
Now i'm in a dilema.....get frontline/ivermectin or spray and louse powder.....or can i frontline and use leg spray?
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Thanks all,
I've been waiting for sally the pilkie's leg/foot to heal up before i go in with the spray.I'm planning to spray and de-louse the whole flock this weekend,along with a very thorough clean of the coop.
Now i'm in a dilema.....get frontline/ivermectin or spray and louse powder.....or can i frontline and use leg spray?
Get ivermectin or Frontline which i suspect are equally effective. I don't know but I suspect Frontline will be more expensive. One works on the body and one via the blood stream. I think Frontline operates via the blood but I'm not sure.
Don't buy anything you will find in your feed merchants store produced by Barrier I've never found their louse powder, red mite spray or powder to be effective (and I'm not the only one) it's just expensive talc for chickens. In fact the powder is mostly sterilised Maize flour. At over £10 a pop at most outlets that's very expensive flour. The active ingredient in them is a mozzie repellent, Citriodiol, and as far as I was able to find out it had not been scientificaly trialed on mites or if it had Barrier were unable to furnish me with any evidence it had despite a long running correspondance with them. I checked with the manufacturer of the active ingredient who had no knowledge of it being tested for effectiveness against mites. Be careful who you trust in the pet meds business there are plenty of quack remedies on sale largely helped by the EU regulations on what testing is needed for pesticides and the cost of getting approval. Not only are these companies robbing you they are preying on your vulnerability and concern for your animal and causing additional suffering by selling ineffective products with exaggerated marketing claims.
You may find this hard to believe but in 2009 Verm X were forced to withdraw advertising claims for the universal effectiveness of their natural organic wormer products after the The Advertising Standards Authority found in a ruling that they were unable to support such claims, ASA ref 74895. ASA don't take action unilaterially they act on complaints so if you don't tread on the big boys toes the chances are even ASA won't act. The Hobbist chicken market is hardly likely to attract their interest.
Things are at a pretty state of affairs when it's left to advertising standards to protect consumers from false claims. You'd think that regulators might do this but they are only interested in ensuring the products don't contain anything which is actually harmful and infact concocting a product from an inert substance like sterilized Maize flour is a pretty sure and cheap way of achieving that.
HF
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If it is any consolation chickens can cope with a fair bit of prodding and poking to their feet. We had Bumblefoot in quite a few of our chickens and ended up using a scalpel to remove the "bumble" and prod around in the hole to ensure all the pus was removed.
All I would say is if you do end up disturbing scales or removing the lump results in an open wound, ensure you dress it and keep it clean and dry.
If you have any doubts it may be worth visiting a poultry friendly vets (I know it's hardly the introduction to keeping chickens that you would want).
Good luck and I hope your chook is soon on the mend. :)
I agree. As long as the chook feels safe in your arms (or another persons preferably)you can do virtually anything to their feet and they wont blink. My OH was too squeamish when I did the surgery on Mont's foot, so I had to do it alone. Please though, if you are in doubt, dont hang around, get her to the vets asap. Good Luck.
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Thanks all!
I've frontlined them and am doing regular scrubs followed by vaseline to help improve things in the meantime.
I musy say that you lot have been a fantastic help. :)
Let's hope for some smooth sailing from now on.
Cheers everyone!!!! :D