[Aunt Sally]

We have no hard areas on our site it's all either plots or grass paths so that would mean to me a chargable area of zero.

[lottienewbie]

Right guys i have had a response from my MP,who is very good at responding to me.
Ofwat have recommended that the way utility companys may charge for the rising cost of treating surface water drainage and sewage as these costs are like everything else rising,with this in place they hope that builders when building new homes will make a provision to use soak aways rather than relying on connecting to the main drainage system,

The points i have raised are shared by my MP regarding the impact it may have on the area,but his understanding of the new system of charging is at the discretion of the water company in your area,and is in response to guidance issued by DEFRA,but he has written to the minister responsible outlining my concerns and will be in touch with me with more information as and when he has it,and i know he is true to his word as i have had issues in the past,which he has indeed followed up on.

  I hope other people are following my route and calling their MP regarding this matter??

i do hope this info is of some use to you all???

regards Neil.

[donald.cape]

More info about my previous post, copied below (how do you do the quote thing I copied and pasted is that right) regardingthe water meters.
The portfolio holder in question said that fitting water meters was probably going to be too costly. Guess what? I've checked on our site and there is a meter already fitted.
I've taken a reading today 29th March ( the water is still turned off) and I'll take another at the end of the season when it's been turned off again . Then I'll be able to see how much a gallon we are being charged.




I was talking to the portfolio holder who has reponsibility for allotments on our Council yesterday about the problems I highlighted at our last Council meeting.
He has asked that United Utilities are investigated about just what they are charging for, ie. water only or charges for sewer connection as well   (that we don't have).
The issuing of bills has been put on hold for the moment until the results of the investigations are known.

He is also looking at the possibility of fitting a water meter to sites, one meter for the full site not each allotment.

He will be coming back to me before anything like that happens though.
I'll let you know when I know more.
Donald Cape

[Joan Kennedy]

I raised this at our committee last night and passed on details of e-petition.  We are also in the north west and have an account with UU.  Our water bill for the last quarter is 51% up fron the same in 2008 - but admittedly affordable at £17.61.  We agreed that the surface water charge should be paid seperately, but with a letter of protest and declaration that we intend to dispute the fairness of the charge.

Thanks very, very much to tinbasher for raising this crucial issue.

[mikem]

I raised this at our committee last night and passed on details of e-petition.  We are also in the north west and have an account with UU.  Our water bill for the last quarter is 51% up fron the same in 2008 - but admittedly affordable at £17.61.  We agreed that the surface water charge should be paid seperately, but with a letter of protest and declaration that we intend to dispute the fairness of the charge.

Thanks very, very much to tinbasher for raising this crucial issue.

Whilst your bill went up by 51% last year remember it was a wet summer.  Our allotment's water bill was about a third of the previous year.  Consequently, if your usage was the same as ours, your bill could have been about 600% of the previous year!

[Tinbasher]

just read some (i know its cheating but its a bit hard to digest all of it) of the thread...not impressed... will be getting onto my lottie lot to see what they know and point them in the right direction. I have signed the petition and will see if i can rally some more people onto it....

Thanks to everyone.  I see there are now 817 signatories to this petition, so steadily growing after a slow start.  I've been telling everyone I know who has an internet connection, family, friends, amateur sports people and of course anyone connected with gardening.

[Yorkie]

I also signed the bigger, churches / sports club petition, and have now received a response:

http://www.number10.gov.uk/Page19160

[John]

I also signed the bigger, churches / sports club petition, and have now received a response:

http://www.number10.gov.uk/Page19160

OK, now can you tell us what the reply means? 

It's in government double-speak.

[mumofstig]

I think it means take it up with OFWAT, or the water company.
In other words........nothing to do with us

[Paul Plots]

I think it means take it up with OFWAT, or the water company.
In other words........nothing to do with us

I think you are spot on.... it appears just to offer information.... with, surprisingly, some level of understand for the situation...

I think it says... - "Yep... that's where Offthing comes in - to protect consumers but it is not our job at them moment to be concerned"........ There is no offer of any help what-so-ever.

Brush hands of the whole mess...

Isn't privatisation a wonderful thing?  What was once everyone’s now belongs to just a few and we have no chance of choosing an alternative supplier. Ours is to pay up (and increase the share holders' profits) and put up or tell Offthing we are not happy and they can slowly wait to see who else is going to kick up a dust before deciding whether to ignore the situation or react supportively.

[richyrich7]

Yeah but it was the blooming secretary of state that recommended ofwat endorse this course of action  or did they conveniently forget that 

[Green-fingered Man]

This is shocking. 

Does it apply to Scotland, too, or just England?

[donald.cape]

Latest on the Water Rates in Carlisle. Since speaking on this in the March Council meeting  our water rates have been reduced to £9 per plot per year. The reason it has gone up from £4 per year is because there are "are to many leaks and United Utilities have put the rates up" according to the officer who looks after the billing etc.

The Council called a meeting of plotholders to discuss forming an Association to run our site ourselves. I didn't attend because I would have had to declare an interest being an Elected Member and that would "tie my hands " in the future. I believe some of the young ladies on the site are quite keen to do the administration work, I'm not sure if it's a good idea or not. I'll have a word with some of the other allotment holders in Carlisle who are already running their sites as an Association.

What does anyone out there think. According to some of the people who attended the meeting the cost would be the same but we could do our own improvements ie running extra water supplies to plots etc.
Any comments from people who are part of an Association would be welcome.

[John]

Self managed and funded has the advantage of control being on the site but that depends on members being willing to do some extra work.

In my experience very few people actually get out there and do something (apart from moan about those who do)

The finances need looking at carefully as well - often councils pay for things that aren't on the individual site's budget.

[Yorkie]

John has really described some of ethe pro's and con's of being self-managed.

I would vote against self-management every time.  In addition to the financial side of things, the independent advice and input of the council officer is a valuable protection against cliques or disillusionment forming at committee level, and also when it comes to decisions about tenancy enforcement / termination / allocation.  Initial enthusiasm often palls to reluctance when life gets busy.

Do not underestimate the amount of paperwork involved in a larger site.  Also how much extra things cost - running water pipes and standpipes can be quite expensive, particularly if the size of the water pipes is not great or the water pressure needs upping to cope with the increased water flow.

It's not clear whether the pressure for self-management came from the Council or the lotties but I'd be very wary as an allotment holder if the council was wanting to divest itself of the hassle of running the site.