[bobbyboy]

You,ve probably heard this before, for this I apologise, but I would appreciate some advice.

I'm new to gardening and am in the process of selling the second love of my life, my boat, and swapping it for the garden.  I have just aquired the bottom half of the garden next door in order to turn it into a vegetable garden.  The greenhouse and shed are now on order!

I am getting on, just a little bit, and have been warned by the Doc that I could have problems with getting about in the future because of an ankle injury that I had some years ago.  Coupled with this I'm not the fittest person in the world, digging and bending doesn't  seem to like my back!

I heard that raised vege plots were a good idea and I thought of having some built. I can't find much information on the internet and would appreciate some advice.

What do you make them off?  I looked at the price of old railway sleepers and almost had a heart attack.  I thought of concrete blocks, has anyone any experience of using these. I know that I could use wooden frames but want to make them last a long while and was concerned that wood does rot in time.

What is the best height?  I have seen all sorts of heights ranging from a few inches to about four feet (sorry but I'm still not metricated yet)  I am 6 foot tall and thought that about 3 feet would be high enought to prevent a lot of stooping and bending.  Is this sensible?  I know that it might be expensive what with the top soil that I would need but don't mind spending the money to get it right.

I know that digging it over will be a problem but have seen some small tillers(?) or rotovators that claim to be ok for raised beds, any tips or advice on these would also be appreciated.

many thanks

Bob

[John]

Hello Bob

Really sorry to hear of your problem - still, hope these ideas help.

First, decide what is going to be comfortable for you. There is no reason why you can't have the beds four feet deep if you want.  Only you can really answer this one. If you intend to use a mechanical cultivator then not so deep you can't reach though.
The Mantis tiller is brilliant and very light. I've used it on my deep beds. I got mine for 180 on ebay - the guy two plots down paid 35.00 for a newer one from an auction.     :evil:   New they are about 300.00

Materials - wood doesn't last forever but you could bulid one from breeze blocks. Be careful if you go really deep that they are strong enough - perhaps a builder if you are as practical as me! Another idea is the concrete they use at the bottom of fence panels. You sink the poles in and then just slot the concrete boards in.

When you've built your beds you have an ideal opportunity to create really  good deep growing medium. Make sure there is plenty of drainage. You can also build frames or use water pipe in hoops to provide mini polytunnels.

You will end up with incredibly productive garden in about half the space of a normal plot. You can space closer together in deep beds, you know?

Only negative is going to be the capital cost, but spaced over the years of pleasure it's not that expensive

Good Luck

[GrannieAnnie]

Hi John, oh fount of all knowledge and wisdom......  I have read before that you can grow things closer together in raised beds than on a normal bed, but why is that???  I'd like to make some raised beds, but OH thinks I'm a wimp, but I have a hernia that hurts when I keep bending over, and a touch of arthritis, so its not just laziness, but I would like to know what difference it makes if the beds are raised.  Many thanks   Ann

[noshed]

Depending on how much cash you have, you could always start by having just slightly mounded beds. My soil is quite heavy and it seems OK in 1.2m wide mounds. I just marked them out with string. The key thing seems to be - don't walk on the beds. The paths soon pack down if the soil is clayey.
With a load of compost on them you can weed with a hoe quite effectively and adjust your posture to a comfotable position (I have a bit of titanium in my spine) . In theory the first couple of inches of soil are the most important.
Get your compost heap going and your manure rotting and you'll be the toast of your allottment site!

[John]

Hi John, oh fount of all knowledge and wisdom......

I wish!!

The thing with deep beds is that they have greater depth of topsoil. If you go down a foot or 18"  into my soil you hit brown clay. An 8" deep bed is adding 50% to the soil depth.
Second, the soil in the deep bed isn't walked on or compacted. This means that there is more air available - plant roots do require air - and it is easier for the roots to push into loose soil.
So because you have a more ideal growing medium you can get more plants in per square foot. Usually you go for equidistant planting. So if you would normally have 8" spacing with 12" between rows, you go for 8" each way.
Also stagger in the rows - like a zig zag to maximise distance between plants.

[GrannieAnnie]

Thanks both for the info.  I will try to wheedle some wood out of OH and make a start!!!

[stompy]

hi there bobbyboy, iv just got myself a plot in Hull, and im building  raised beds as well.
im using old scafolding boards for the sides £2 each 13ft long, and 2x2 posts, just one board high at first, they are about 1,1/2" thick so they should last quite a few years.
and if i want to make them higher i can just screw another board on top.

[Jake]

£2 each is pretty good, well pretty damn good, I'll be phoning a scafolding company tomorrow I think.

Nice one stompy

[GrannieAnnie]

mmmmm, me too I think.  Didnt think about them, When I mentioned raised beds to OH he just said but sleepers are very expensive these days!!! But that's only because he doesn't want to part with any of his precious wood!!!! lol

[bobbyboy]

Hi Guys (and Gals)

Many thanks for the feedback,  why didn't I think of the concrete posts and  panels.

Thanks also for the info on the tillers.

I have to do some hunting around now!

regards

Bob

[bobbyboy]

Hi all,

I'm back again with an update that might interest anyone who is thinking of doing this.

Looking at the idea of concrete posts I contacted our local suppliers in Bungay.  Apparently no one does concrete fencing panels any more, that they are aware of, but suggested using the 12 inch concrete gravel boards that you can buy to protect the bottom of wooden panels.

I contacted the manufacturers, Alan Concrete, and the sales guy was very helpful.  he told me that they have a lot of enquiries both for raised beds and retaining walls using the gravel posts.  He recommended that I did not go down this route.  With the boards only being required to protect a light wooden panel they are not very thick and they have had reports of the gravel boards cracking with the weight of the earth.  He suggested:

1. Use hollow conrecte blocks.
2. when these are in situ then place reinforcing bars through them.
3. then fill them with concrete. :shock:

Railway sleepers suddenly look a more attractive proposition!

Regards

Bob

[spud]

Hi bobbyboy & all,

Firstly this is my first post, hopefully it will help.

I have grown my own veg for about 10 years now, and have a plot 25m by 30m. It has become such a lot of work, I have been looking for ways to have a similar yield but much less work.

So I managed to get 8' by 4' sheets of exterrior plywood and have them cut length wise into 1' by 8' strips, ideal for making a raised bed. Each sheet will make a bed 12' by 4' just perfect for my job.

I have 3/4 filled them with well rotted manure, and topped them up with several inches of homegrown compost (chicken manure and grasscuttings), and a dressing of organic bone meal. In the past few days I have sown out my seeds in the first one and I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this season will be a bumper one!

I believe that this system will give me good yields due to the high fertility in the beds and I dont have to dig them...I just keep them wed and add fresh compost each year...sounds too good to be true...but hey its looking great so far!

I hope this is of some help to others considering raised no dig beds, the planting is quite a bit closer than in drills, and this is what helps in supressing the weeds.

Best Regards,
 

[GrannieAnnie]

Thanks for that idea Spud.  I can't dig for long anymore, as it hurts if I bend and lift for more than about half an hour at a time.  However, we are probably selling this place next year and OH has said its not worth making raised beds for this place, but at least he is coming around to the fact that a raised bed and less digging might be better for me now I'm getting older!  But I have started to put things under black plastic.  Well, terran actually, we got a load from an little nursery that closed down last August.  I've put some of my potatoes under it, and Friday put another strip down.  I didn't actually dig that bit of ground though.  Several years ago, I bought one of those cheaper versions of the garden claw.  Not used it much as a cetain someone took the mickey, but I did use it Friday, and it loosened the soil and weeds, and the ground is just right now for planting those potatoes once it stops raining!!!!

[Grahame]

I am new to veg growing too and have spent the last couple of months constructing raised beds not very high, just about 4 inches or so to aid drainage and hopefully cut down on future work. I decided to splash out and use treated timber cos I want them to last as long as poss. Mostly they are 8'x4' but also some 16'x4'. I have brought in tons of reclaimed topsoil, very old manure and home grown compost to fill them, it's been hard work (now have a backache to prove it!). I incorporated the new soil etc with the existing soil on the plot to try and get a balance and have added some growmore prior to sowing/planting. Just hoping for the best now.  

[spud]

Just an update on how things have turned out!

My deep / raised beds have been the best thing I tried in veg growing to date. I wish I had a digital camera so I could let you see for your self, fantastic vegies and sooo little work, the way it should be in the garden of Eden.

I had the best quality vegies yet! I tried a few new ideas...when harvesting cabbage and cauliflower I laid the unwanted leaves etc on the soil surface between the remaining crops to feed the slugs, worms etc....(not on my compost heap)and I believe it works the leaves on the soil are full of holes and my crops appear to have very little damage...interesting I thought!

I have ordered 4 more sheets of plywood as I intend to make this my system for growing and I need more beds.

The tight planting really keeps the weeds down, I had a little work when first planted out, but after that hardly any work and virtually weed free...a big change for my garden.

This is the way to go....work with nature not against.....the earth does not like being bare..hense weeds etc. Keep it covered with your mulch. Traditional methods mean a lot of bare earth between rows and a fight with nature to see who wins...worth a few moments thought, maybe.

I'm a converted traditionalist for sure!

Hope I havn't annoyed anyone...just trying to share in my success this season.

Best Regards,