Allotment Gardening Advice Help Chat

Poultry and Pets => Poultry FAQs and other Information => Topic started by: Casey76 on September 20, 2009, 12:38

Title: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Casey76 on September 20, 2009, 12:38
It has made me so sad over the past few days to hear of peoples frustrations with sick birds, to the point of wanting to give up before they have barely begun.

I fully understand the addictiveness of hen-keeping, especially in the beginning.  You plan for 3, in a week or two you decide you want a couple/few more... please, please before you go out and buy more consider if you have the facilities and space for quarantine.

New hens should be quarantined from your existing flock for at least two weeks.  They will need a separate pen and house, either within your exisiting run, or in a separate run all together.

One of the main risks of bringing in new birds is bringing in new disease.  Coccidiosis is a latent disease.  Once your birds have had it (and it is possible that they may catch it and not necessarily show symptoms) they have it for life and become carriers.  Now although people talk about coccidiosis often, they do not often say that there are many, many "strains" of coccidiosis, and though your birds may have immunity to one strain this does not mean they have immunity to all strains, so the likelihood of your birds coming down with cocci upon rapid introduction of new birds may be quite high.

Mycoplasma is another disease which is very readily transferrable between birds.  It is responsible for a lot of the runny noses and bubbly eyes you see with a "cold."

Hens are very prone to being "stressed", moving from one place to another, being shut in a box, maybe a car journey etc are huge stressors and therefore for a few days or even weeks your new hens may appear, quiet, withdrawn, depressed, show little interest in food or water. 

During this time I would keep a very basic diet, so layers pellets or mash (for POL or older hens) with a vitamin tonic in the water, but no "treats."  If your chooks are realy not eating mashed up hardboiled eggs mixed with a little tinned beef or fish catfood will often go down well.

It is during this period of stress that any latent diseases may flare up and cause problems, which is why it is so important that the new birds be separated from the exisiting flock.

If you do not have the space for a quarantine, have you thought about what you would do if one of your birds gets sick or injured and needs to be separated from the main flock anyway?

While you have two separate flocks, you should ensure hygeine control.  i.e. disinfect hands, change clothes and shoes before going from one flock to another... yes it is hard work and time consuming maintaining a proper quarantine, but we are trying to maintain the health of your birds!

This is not meant to "get at" anyone, but there seem to be a lot of new hen-friends one the board at the moment, so I just thought I'd mention this to try and avoid the frustrations and sadness we have seen over the past couple of weeks.

Katrina
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Aunt Sally on September 20, 2009, 12:54
Many thanks for this excellent advise Katrina !

I have made it into a sticky for now and will add it to our "Useful topics"" sticky in due course :D
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: karlooben on September 20, 2009, 19:44
i have a quantine pen within my main run as its the only place i can put it and its already been used an was a great help but looks like i may be re using it from tomorw but need to really really jeyes out the isolation house first as i have 1 girl mainly whos gone very skinny an goes quiet then picks up then goes quiet personally i do think shes a very old girl but to make sure she gets the wormer an maybe some tylan she'll go in there with another girl who looks a bit skinny .

p;s they will all be wormed next week before i get bombarded with they all need worming  :lol: :lol: dogs will be done horses will be done ouchhhhhhhh expensive week next week but who cares .
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Nails on September 21, 2009, 19:08
This has been really useful info, i wished this had been on here before i started losing my babies. But it has all been taken on board now. Thank you Casey
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: North Devon Dumpling on September 21, 2009, 19:12
A hypothetical question really.  If you buy from a supplier who vaccinates would you still need to quarantine (good practice to do it anyway, but just wondered).

Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: kitkat on September 21, 2009, 19:51
Yes , you should always quarantine birds even if vaccinated.
    Just to say i think original birds should always be seen to first, when opening up of a morning and feeding etc, then see to new ones.
   From another Katrina in France :tongue2:
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Caralou on September 21, 2009, 20:01
I can only say that this is excellent advice.

I always quarantine for 4 weeks but only have one quarantine coop and run. This has just proved itself a life saver as a Poland I got from the local poultry dealer had a symptomless illness that passed to two other chicks I got a week later time and had put in together, they both passed within a week but the Poland only became symptomatic after they died.

I wish I had, had the facilities to have kept the chicks and her seperate from the other girls and then perhaps they too would have been saved, but i do not have space for more than one quantine hutch. BUT, by quarantine I have at least saved all the others from getting ill - it would have been a big loss to me of 8 full grown, 6 home reared chicks and possibly the 2 ducks had I not had them seperated.

In future I will not bring in more new birds from more than one place at the same time and will continue quarantining for 4 weeks. Please listen to Katrina and other experienced chicken keepers advice, it really will save lives.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: newatthis on September 21, 2009, 20:04
hi, this may be a silly question but with a quarantine run, how big and can it be in the same area as the main run ie   i have a run thats 12 ft by 18 ft, so i could put to 1 side so to speak, 4ft wide by 12ft long?, with their own 4ft x 4ft house..
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Caralou on September 21, 2009, 20:14
I have mine in a totally seperate part of the garden. The girls have the main garden which is fenced from my patio. I then have the isolation coop and run on the patio. That way I know there will be no sneeze crossing etc and I wash hand between handling of the hens in the garden and the hens in the coop. It was also useful when I had an eggbound girl to isolate her in there. Just also remember to fully disenfect the isolation coop after each use as bugs linger.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: karlooben on September 22, 2009, 19:10
my quantine run is within the main run that is 10 m by 6 m an the quantine pen is about 2 m by 2m . if the bird is poorly the last thing it would want to do is be running around .
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: ema.whte on December 13, 2009, 14:01
Superb advice I've never even considered having a quarantine coop and run. It hasn't occurred to me what I would do in case my chickens got sick or one would be injured. Again thanks for this post.

Emma
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: hillfooter on December 21, 2009, 12:35
The quarantine run can be a lot smaller and of a temporary nature.  I use a small triangular ark of the sort you can buy quite cheaply on ebay which is roughly a 0.8m sided triangular cross section and 1m long.   These aren't very viable as perminent houses but are cheap and light weight to move about and useful as broody coops and quarentine quarters or even for young growers as a first house.

For a run I've made 1.8m X 0.9m mesh panels using trellis baton which is 38 X19 mm section.  Use one bracing 0.9m baton in the centre of the panel and small 45 deg triangular corner fillets to hold it together and keep it rigid.  I fixed it with a panel pin gun and then screwed it together drilling pilot holes first as the baton splits easily.  

I've made 4 of these panels and they can quickly be arranged in a tent like extension to the ark.  A couple of 70mm square section bearers about 1m long with 60deg slots cut in them keep the panels in place along the bottom of the triangle.  A 90cm isosceles triangular panel forms the end of the run.  Hold the whole thing together using bungee ropes (as used on luggage racks), and you have a cheap, simple quick to errect and easy to stow temporary run which can be extended in 1.8m lengths. One tweek is to cut the slots in the bottom bearers so that one panel can be hingled to an upright position for access.

A sheltered roof can easily be made with a thick piece of polythene (a scrap bit of damp proof course membrane is ideal) 1.8m X.9m over the ark pophole entrance held down with bungees completes the setup and provides a place to keep the feeder dry.

Site it on a concrete base close to the house is ideal.

It's not fox proof but as a temporary home for a couple of weeks it's very useful.

Merry Christmas
HF
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Foxy on December 21, 2009, 14:48
I have a trio in quarantine right now. A trio of bantams in a 4X4 raised shed with windows and a tiny bit of heat to help reduce stress, although I even know who the grandparents of these birds, it is still crucial to keep separate for at least 2 weeks.
When it comes to feeding/checks etc., they are done last so I dont inadvertantly cross contaminate my existing stock.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Bonniebean on December 21, 2009, 17:13
Can I ask your opinions on using a raised two part rabbit hutch as a quarantine area if I need it. I am not talking about getting new birds, just for incase one of them gets poorly. I have one that was given to me for rescuing hedgehogs but now I have a hedgehog house and wondered if this would be suitable. It is just in the garden at the moment but I thought I might enclose it in my plastic greenhouse which is going to a semi shaded area where nothing much grows in the ground.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Sarah Mitchell on January 20, 2010, 12:44
Hi Bonnie

I've used rabbit hutches before for sick birds or broodies sitting on eggs - should be fine for a short period of time. 

Sarah
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Bonniebean on January 20, 2010, 16:15
Thanks Sarah, it was just an idea as I have one spare which I keep for waifs and strays!
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: janet12000 on January 20, 2010, 17:09
I used a rabbit hutch to look after one of my hens while she was recovering from a fox attack.

She was very cosy and didn't want to move out when she was better.  :lol:
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: IMOmimey on January 20, 2010, 21:12
I use a spare run/coop. It was my first, and so much smaller than I anticipated, it is pretty useless for anything BUT temporary housing, so I keep it for quarantine. I wash thoroughly with 10% jeyes, using a power spray, and stalosan on the area on the area of ground it was on.

Siting a run within a run, or adjacent kind of defeats the object, as sneezes and coughs can easily transmit disease to a nosy chook just on her way past  :(

Also, a small tip... young chicks need to be in a covered run, where older choox and/or wild birds cant poop into their pen. I'm told that this is one of the biggest causes of cocci in growers. (Babies with their broodies are ok, they are believed to aquire immunity from their mummy.  :tongue2:
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Hawkins on March 04, 2010, 18:07
Im off to see some new chickens on the weekend Im hoping to get 4 or 6 from the same breeder. My quarantine coop is set up but I have to put it in the girls original electric fencing run which is 100m.

Im planning on seperating the new from the old by 2 fences to try and combat the sneeze barrier thing. How much room do you thing i need to leave between fences. 1meter 2 meters or more.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: hillfooter on March 04, 2010, 21:47
The more the less the risk but I couldn't say what distance ensures absolute safety.  I suspect just preventing contact will probably eliminate 80% of the risk and increasing the separation will improve upon that.  I'd guess 5m is probably good for 95% ish and thereafter the risk declines slowly with distance.  These are just my rough feelings but I suspect it's something along these lines.
HF
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: joyfull on March 12, 2010, 08:14
I agree with HF just preventing contact will eliminate most problems - not sure how far any droplets can spray when a chicken sneezes but don't think it's too far.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: tamnwill on March 16, 2010, 03:28
Just a thought after reading this excellent advice, I have a quarentine house for just incase, but is it ok to let them share the same garden, at different times of course?
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: joyfull on March 16, 2010, 05:00
I wouldn't just in case there is anything infectious in their pooh. My newbies go into an ark with a run attached until I am sure about them.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: jhub on May 25, 2010, 17:32
I agree with HF just preventing contact will eliminate most problems - not sure how far any droplets can spray when a chicken sneezes but don't think it's too far.

have just been on an American website and the resident vet stated that respiratory viruses spread by droplets can travel >120 yards on the wind. How scary is that?
and how sad am I that my favourite websites are all about chooks- am even making them at pottery classes!
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: pandoradeus on August 10, 2010, 14:44
being a newbie looking to expand my flock - I was going to get some more from the same breeder I got my original Ladies from - I know what you;ll say but I'd rather feel a bit stupid asking than not :), but is quarantine necessary in this situation?
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: joyfull on August 10, 2010, 18:28
yes - you don't know if he has had any infections since you got your original girls. Also it helps with the introductions - have them separated but in full view of each other and then move them together bit by bit until they are just separated by the wire. This makes for an easier introduction.
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: hillfooter on August 11, 2010, 01:24
I agree with HF just preventing contact will eliminate most problems - not sure how far any droplets can spray when a chicken sneezes but don't think it's too far.

have just been on an American website and the resident vet stated that respiratory viruses spread by droplets can travel >120 yards on the wind. How scary is that?

Well not that scary really as the risk drops off very rapidly as the density of any infectious organism spreads in the air over distance.  True that aerosols can carry over a kilometre I've seen quoted however the risk of infection is very low and considerably lower than being spread though contact with wild birds or animals including humans, cars and trucks. 

You've considerably more chance of catching a cold from someone sneezing next to you on a bus than you have from someone sneezing a hundred metres away down the road probably in the order of over tens of millions of times more likely and actually only theoretically quantifiable.
HF
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: Laine21 on August 25, 2010, 15:42
Have learned this in a very hard way. a little while ago we purchased eggs to hatch, but only 3 boys hatched. But we had fallen in love with them so they stayed, to be sure of healthy birds we bought 6 young hens from the SAME breeder .
They did not all meet until the following week. Unfortunately we then lost 1 girl we thought at the time through stress with moving, and the breeder said she had never lost any.
 During the following week another girl started to limp, the breeder thought she had perhaps pulled a muscle, a visit to the vet and the vet gave an anti inflamatory jab, and kept her away from the others. This did not work, she just got worse. We took some video clips and sent them to 2 other breeders and to a vet, the consenus is Mareks.

A week further on, and just over 4 weeks since the girls arrived and this morning one of my beautiful boys could not get out of the coop, his legs cannot hold him, he, like the other one has other symptoms, irregular eye colour and green runny poops, and also has raised feathers.

I have been advised by the Veterinary Laboratories Agency that now Mareks has been on my property, it will ALWAYS be there. When  I come to replace the birds I can only have vaccinated birds, so no buying from a small breeder again.

You think you are doing right, but there is always more to learn.

Apparently with Mareks, birds can be lifelong carriers, and you will never know if you bring a bird into your group has it until you begin to have fatalities, unless your birds have been previously vaccinated of course.

The breeder initially offered to refund the cost of the birds, but is now not answering my messages.
Its been a very hard lesson.
Laine
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: hillfooter on August 26, 2010, 01:31
A sad and salutary lesson indeed Laine.  There but for the grace of god etc. Grumpy Dad has had a long and ongoing battle with Mareks and has a similar story to tell.

Small breeders are vulnerable if they have a significant throughput of birds and don't vaccinate and even vaccinated stock may still be carriers.  In Grumpy Dads case the birds he had were claimed to be vaccinated.  Even when vaccinated correctly 5% fail to develop immunity so there's no 100% solution all you can do is take as much care as you can.

You should get your current birds vaccinated even now Laine as this should prevent them developing the tumours even though they will remain carriers of the virus.  Horizontal transmission will be much reduced after vaccination.  Mareks is not vertically transmitted so hatching eggs is one way of introducing new stock which will be Mareks free.  Vaccination at an early age will 'prevent them picking up the virus.  Chicks are naturally immune for the first two or three weeks anyway.  Of course there are plenty of other nasty diseases that can be vertically passed so using hatching eggs isn't a panacea and you still need to be sure of the origin of your eggs.  This is why I don't buy on ebay as you are very vulnerable to unscrupulous sellers.  I know 99.9% are perfectly genuine but one mistake as Laine has shown can cause tragedy.

The best strategy is know your sources and keep introductions to a minimum ie don't buy stock in ones and two from several sources that just increases risk.  Quarentine any new stock for 3 weeks minimum.  There's no guarentees but that's all you can do.
Best wishes
HF
Title: Re: Importance of quarantine
Post by: joyfull on August 26, 2010, 08:38
wise words there HF, know your breeder indeed - sadly I fell foul of one whose practises left a lot to be desired  :(