soil set like concrete

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chimaera

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soil set like concrete
« on: June 07, 2010, 16:57 »
In N London we have had one day of drizzly rain in a month and the soil is now so hard I bent the tines on a stainless steel fork trying to dig it. I have been having to soak the ground so that the I can get a trowel into it.
I dream of soil that turns to dust when it dries out.

(and i have worked at it, in the last 3 years that part of the plot has been dug over 7 times and I have put about 300 kilos of council compost into the ground)

Charlie

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mr Isaccs

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2010, 17:07 »
Sounds like your soil would be good for brasicas then Charlie, they like it firm :)
   Seriously though, one of my fellow plot holders has terrible clay soil and requested the use of my rotovator to try and break it up after it had baked solid, he had a terrible time and still couldn't get it fine.
   He's added sharp sand and tons of manure over the past couple of years and still no joy with it yet.
   I feel for you both and think myself very fortunate to have well worked soil (well on one plot anyway).
   Hope you manage in time to get a good tilth, keep at it :)
I'm banned for being obnoxious (not pompous as you might have thought)

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iggyboy

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2010, 17:45 »
If I was you I would seriously thinking about raised beds.
...the night was dark...they usually are!

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Zippy

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2010, 23:34 »
The no dig system is perfect for this.

Layer on:

A single layer of corrugated cardboard overlapping edges by about 8cm to cut out light. This stifles most perrenial weeds.

Lawn mowings, alfalfa or any other soft green wited veg waste.

Straw bale broken up to give a good three inch layer; wetted down.

Wetted newspaper layer; about four sheets thick, overlapping.

Layer of Manure or organic fertilizer, or more green manure.

Finally the entire contents of your compost bin if it is well rotted, or any spent compost.

Leave for a couple of weeks for the rotting process to begin and then plant into the multilayer bed.



No dig beds are marginally warmer due to the constant decomposition going on and are highly nutritious for any hungry crop. really good for potatoes, leeks, squashes. Growing beans on this bed will increase nitrogen.

You will never have to bother with the hard soil underneath. In fact as the worms tunnel through to drag all the decaying matter down, they will break up the soil for you.

I'm not mad - I did this successfully in Leicester's clag, so it will work for you.

Now I'm doing it on Cornwall's sandy soil to help build some heart into the local dust. given the choice I think I would rather have your clay.

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chimaera

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2010, 08:36 »
To be honest, I seem to have the problem with the soil, not the plants and with the exception of parsnips (that look like turnips but taste fine) everything seems to grow fine. It is just very hard work and annoying when I can't do 'normal' things like use a rake (it bounces over the surface or embeds in a clay lump depending on the time of year) or use a spade rather than fork to dig with.

Getting hold of large amounts of manure and straw are not easy and very expensive in London (lot a lot of fields round here!), and my plot is in a position where I don't think you could get a trailer to it anyway.
Neighbours just seem to rely on rotovating 3 times a year (after harvesting, early Spring and before planting); I think I have no choice but to buy one which is an expense I didn't want, and putting all the recycling compost on that they can get hold of.

Charlie

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mr Isaccs

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2010, 10:21 »
I got my rorovator from E-bay Charle, It's only an old tiller and  cost me £79, I know that even though I got a good deal £79 is still alot to spend out considering allotmenteering is supposed to be a cheap way of eating /growing fresh veg but once you've got it yo'll have it for years.
   This is only my second season growing and over the last couple of years I've spent a fortune, i could have bought the produce alot cheaper from the supermarket(not as fresh though).
   Now though I have all the tools I need and don't intend o spend any more for a few years except for seeds, compost and manure

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Zippy

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2010, 10:55 »
There's always boimass around if only you look out for it. Municipal lawn mowings, fallen leaves. Join Freecycle and offer to take people's lawn mowings away and their autumn leaves for leaf mould. I will bet London homes mow their lawns regularly and would love you to take their clippings away for them - watch out for Weed and Feed!

Contact your local council and ask about green waste. Maybe they offer compost? Have a composter at home and make your own compost etc, etc.

Do you know anyone with a rabbit/guinea pig etc? Or birds? Great manures.

... and then there's all those broadsheet newspapers for layering.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2010, 10:57 by Zippy »

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chimaera

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2010, 17:32 »
We get deliveries of rotted green waste from at the site, with maybe 5-10 loads a year. Problem is it doesn't go far between all the plots, and arrives mid week so the people who are there all day usually get it all, and there is just a pile of twigs left in the evening. I have already used maybe a third of a tonne of the stuff though.
Garden at home is small and not a lot of grass cutting to have, especially as OH keeps putting weedkiller on the lawn...
Charlie

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paintedlady

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2010, 05:40 »
Do you work and have a communal tea room or cafeteria?  I can't afford to buy stuff such as sharp sand and the tonnes of compost needed to improve the soil, so I asked if I could put a collection bin there and asked people to throw all their tea bags, coffee grains and fruit peelings into it and every week took it to the allotment.  Like you, the soil is so bad on my big plot that after digging over, even just spring sunshine would bake the clods into solid briquettes so I just pile the compostables directly on top of the soil throughout the year and then add a layer of manure in late winter.  It acts like a mulch so keeps the clay soil underneath nice & moist.  Can't say it has improved the soil structure as I haven't been able to dig it in, but as I grow mainly summer fruiting crops on that plot, they really seem to thrive in it.  The downside is of course an explosion of slugs & snails but can be dealt with  ;)
Failure is only a temporary change in direction to set you straight for your next success.
Only those who dare to fail greatly can ever achieve greatly.

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compostqueen

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Re: soil set like concrete
« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2010, 11:03 »
I think you will have to use manures, composts, home made compost (which you can make lots of - anyone can)  Fallen leaves are free and you can start collecting them. They are ace  :D  It takes time and you don't have to do it all at once.  Just laying stuff on the top and leaving it over winter will make a noticeable difference. You can just concentrate on one area at a time. The plot will still be there tomorrow. Raised beds is another option

Rotovating the concrete won't help the problem and you'll probably end up with a hard pan on the top

Getting the materials onto it is the best thing so I think you'll have to bit the bullet



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