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Author Topic: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy  (Read 263 times)

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JudithD

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Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« on: November 02, 2017, 11:15 »
Hi, I am hoping to find some help here for my sister-in-law and her teenage son. They both suffer from a very severe gluten-allergy which restricts them from eating basically everything at the moment. Her vegetable supplier has decided to plant his fields with rye for a green manure this autumn/winter, and since their allergy is so bad, they can't eat anything that is coming of those fields in the future. Another supplier didn't tell her he was using chicken-manure recently, and they fell very ill.
They are surviving on potatoes now, and some previous supplies in the freezer, which run out very fast now.
Now my question: I want to help them by growing vegetables in my plot in 2018, but since even chicken- and horse manure are off limits, I don't know what to compost my plot with.
Here in the Netherlands we don't have access to seaweed-manure, otherwise that would be an idea.
Does anybody know of a manure or compost available (preferably with an online shop that will send abroad) that we could use?

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JayG

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2017, 13:26 »
As someone with limited knowledge of the subject I'm struggling to understand the relationship between the type of manure used, and the safety or otherwise of the crop grown from them.
Found this:

Quote
Foods without gluten
The list of off-limit items may seem daunting at first. Thankfully, there are plenty of replacements on the menu. Lots of foods are naturally gluten-free, including:
•fruits and vegetables
•beans
•seeds
•legumes
•nuts
•potatoes
•eggs
•dairy products
•oils and vinegars
•corn
•rice
•fish
•lean beef
•chicken
•seafood

Many other grains and foods are gluten-free as well:
•amaranth
•arrowroot
•buckwheat
•cassava
•millet
•quinoa
•sorghum
•soy
•tapioca

Source: https://www.healthline.com/health/allergies/gluten-food-list#foods-to-eat3

Not been able to find any evidence that even if the manure did contain some gluten that it would find its way into a non-gluten containing crop grown in it.  :unsure:
Sow your seeds, plant your plants, and plonk your potatoes in the soil.

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mumofstig

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2017, 14:22 »
My immediate reaction was how can previous crops make the soil contain gluten? but appears it can happen  :wacko: Perhaps some people are super-sensitive?

http://www.cureceliacdisease.org/faq/is-soil-that-was-used-to-grow-gluten-containing-foods-contaminated/
Quote
Frequently Asked Questions
Q: Is soil that was used to grow gluten-containing foods contaminated?
 
A: Soil can be contaminated if previously used to grow gluten-containing foods. It may take four years for the soil to become gluten free again.  July, 2012

but would chicken manure really contain gluten?? That I struggle with tbh
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JayG

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2017, 16:23 »
Even though gluten is a protein and therefore readily biodegradable, I can understand how those unfortunate enough to have a very severe allergy can't take any chances - the farmer choosing rye as a green manure must represent a risk that next year's crops could come in contact with the gluten they produced before being ploughed in, although I'd be surprised if anything other than root crops could be affected, and then only if they weren't well washed first.

As Mum has said, it's hard to imagine that chicken or horse manure presents a risk, especially if well composted before use.

Feel free to post any links to information about this which is to the contrary - we are obviously trying to help but hopefully Mum won't mind me saying that it's only (slightly) educated guesswork.  ;)

JudithD

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2017, 17:44 »
I really don't have any other 'evidence' than their experiences sofar. Because chickens and horses usually are fed with grains, their manure contains at least traces of gluten, so they tell me. TLike JayG says, the rye can develop gluten if not ploughed in at the right time. And yes, they are extremely sensitive, unfortunately. They won't try my vegetables if I am to use chicken or horse manure for their crops, they just can't take the risk.
I feel so bad for them.
I still hope someone has a solution :-)

mumofstig

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2017, 18:00 »
You can buy dried seaweed meal here in the uk, they sell on ebay - postage to you may be prohibitive though?

Could you use some of the other green manures such as Phacelia Tanacetifolia, clovers or Winter tares(legume family)?

8doubles

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2017, 18:36 »
Even though gluten is a protein and therefore readily biodegradable, I can understand how those unfortunate enough to have a very severe allergy can't take any chances - the farmer choosing rye as a green manure must represent a risk that next year's crops could come in contact with the gluten they produced before being ploughed in, although I'd be surprised if anything other than root crops could be affected, and then only if they weren't well washed first.

As Mum has said, it's hard to imagine that chicken or horse manure presents a risk, especially if well composted before use.

Feel free to post any links to information about this which is to the contrary - we are obviously trying to help but hopefully Mum won't mind me saying that it's only (slightly) educated guesswork.  ;)

Surely the gluten will not be present in an unripe rye plant when it is ploughed in ?

JayG

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2017, 20:21 »
 8D - you're probably right and I think the same but JudithD is looking for certainty and I can't provide that.

grinling

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2017, 21:34 »
Some interesting websites out there
 TEST FOR GLUTEN   The following test is very easy to do and the reagent does not cost much, other than the reagent you just need something to hold samples you want to test (test tube, even a small mason jar will do nicely.)
The Biuret test:
Biuret solution is a blue liquid that changes to purple when proteins are present and to pink in the presence of short chains of polypeptides. The copper atom of the biuret solution reacts with the peptide bonds to cause the color change.

THIS BOOK WAS MENTIONED The Resilient Gardener by Carol Deppe

JudithD

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2017, 10:21 »
Thanks everyone! I am really chuffed with the test-idea. And we are probably gonna buy some seaweed manure via Ebay, or maybe even from the Netherlands since I had an email saying that it was available, albeit it very expensive where we live.

sunshineband

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Re: Problems with manure - compost due to glutenallergy
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2017, 13:42 »
You can of course use your own homemade compost; even grass cuttings mixed with shredded paper soon rot down, and can be put in trenches to help beans and peas grow as the mix retains water very well. Blood, fish & bone is likely to be suitable to use for added nutrients too
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